From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Juan M. Gonzalez Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Emacs as word processor Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2013 10:20:06 +0000 (UTC) Message-ID: References: <87r4adfwot.fsf@earlgrey.lan> <874n6aowfc.fsf@dod.no> <87r49eyo3j.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1387189246 24658 80.91.229.3 (16 Dec 2013 10:20:46 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2013 10:20:46 +0000 (UTC) To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Mon Dec 16 11:20:52 2013 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1VsVIB-0004nW-QE for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 16 Dec 2013 11:20:51 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:55157 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VsVIB-0005CH-8I for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 16 Dec 2013 05:20:51 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:53491) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VsVI2-0005Bc-L4 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 16 Dec 2013 05:20:47 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VsVHw-0001Fz-8J for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 16 Dec 2013 05:20:42 -0500 Original-Received: from plane.gmane.org ([80.91.229.3]:38224) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VsVHv-0001Fj-ET for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 16 Dec 2013 05:20:36 -0500 Original-Received: from list by plane.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1VsVHm-0004QF-JQ for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 16 Dec 2013 11:20:26 +0100 Original-Received: from 85.219.26.62.dyn.user.ono.com ([85.219.26.62]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2013 11:20:26 +0100 Original-Received: from juanmgonzalezrey by 85.219.26.62.dyn.user.ono.com with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2013 11:20:26 +0100 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ Original-Lines: 58 Original-X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: sea.gmane.org User-Agent: Loom/3.14 (http://gmane.org/) X-Loom-IP: 85.219.26.62 (Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:17.0) Gecko/20131030 Firefox/17.0 Iceweasel/17.0.10) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Genre and OS details not recognized. X-Received-From: 80.91.229.3 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:166466 Archived-At: T.V. Raman gmail.com> writes: > > I spent about 6 years (2000 -- 2006) investing in XMl hoping > that it would give us s-expressions -- sadly it gave everything > but. > > To me the living proof of this is that in 2013, I write org > files by hand -- in 2001 when I was still dreaming the xml will > give us s-expressions dream, I wrote xml and html by hand - the > zenith was nxml-mode -- but though nxml-mode is a marvellous > piece of work, xml dragged in far too much of the old sgml > baggage, without bringing much new to the party -- > > -- > > On 12/15/13, Stephen J. Turnbull xemacs.org> wrote: > > Steinar Bang writes: > > > > > FWIW I really would have liked to see an s-expression based text > > > document file format see actual use. > > > > XML! About those possibilities, Richard Stallman has been asked, in this thread, "1. What would you recommend as the backend format?" His answer: "It would be good to support several, including some use of HTML, ODF, and maybe Texinfo." http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-devel/2013-11/msg00557.html http://article.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.devel/165333 And also about the Org-mode markup as storage format: "I am sure that it will support this format, because that's not the hard part." http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-devel/2013-11/msg01138.html http://article.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.devel/165914 That's reasonable. If we look at LibreOffice Writer, that RMS has mentioned as an example, it can save in a good number of different formats: .odt, .txt, .html, .xml, etc. And about the compatibility between formats? Let's say we have a document in a format that allows embedded LaTeX for math formulae, etc., like Org markup or the latest MultiMarkdown, and we want to save it in a more limited format such as plain Markdown. That's solved by LibreOffice in a simple way, with a warning: "This document may contain formatting or content that cannot be saved in the currently selected file format". However, it lets us go ahead, and saves what is supported in the format chosen by the user. So it seems an optional minor WYSIWYG mode that could be used by Emacs major modes, and which would allow a number of different formats, is a suggested way. Especially for text markups already supported by Emacs and its different major modes.