From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Tom Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Emacs learning curve Date: Thu, 15 Jul 2010 10:09:07 +0000 (UTC) Message-ID: References: <4C3B6A8A.80105@gmx.de> <87wrt0e81n.fsf@telefonica.net> <62E9699C07054418AB66F9C5FCB54E5C@us.oracle.com> <87sk3oe3la.fsf@telefonica.net> <1154D96E7D2F401D849266F359E44BB9@us.oracle.com> <87ocecdzou.fsf@telefonica.net> <2256C17F740A425884AD551DE7758056@us.oracle.com> <87fwzodqqm.fsf@telefonica.net> <5138CDF30B2D4B778F948015614DA7BC@us.oracle.com> <87iq4ijtdy.fsf@lola.goethe.zz> <838w5dgln1.fsf@gnu.org> <87d3updqup.fsf@lola.goethe.zz> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: dough.gmane.org 1279188581 7743 80.91.229.12 (15 Jul 2010 10:09:41 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@dough.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 15 Jul 2010 10:09:41 +0000 (UTC) To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Thu Jul 15 12:09:39 2010 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1OZLNq-0007Dg-R3 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 15 Jul 2010 12:09:39 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:34758 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1OZLNq-0007RU-3z for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 15 Jul 2010 06:09:38 -0400 Original-Received: from [140.186.70.92] (port=43591 helo=eggs.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1OZLNh-0007RM-Qk for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 15 Jul 2010 06:09:30 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1OZLNf-0007nh-Da for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 15 Jul 2010 06:09:29 -0400 Original-Received: from lo.gmane.org ([80.91.229.12]:52766) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1OZLNe-0007nd-Vm for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 15 Jul 2010 06:09:27 -0400 Original-Received: from list by lo.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1OZLNZ-0007Ai-Rd for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 15 Jul 2010 12:09:21 +0200 Original-Received: from 94-21-242-87.pool.digikabel.hu ([94.21.242.87]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Thu, 15 Jul 2010 12:09:21 +0200 Original-Received: from levelhalom by 94-21-242-87.pool.digikabel.hu with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Thu, 15 Jul 2010 12:09:21 +0200 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ Original-Lines: 40 Original-X-Complaints-To: usenet@dough.gmane.org X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: sea.gmane.org User-Agent: Loom/3.14 (http://gmane.org/) X-Loom-IP: 94.21.242.87 (Opera/9.80 (Windows NT 6.1; U; en) Presto/2.6.30 Version/10.60) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 3) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:127343 Archived-At: David Kastrup gnu.org> writes: > Why should they switch their editor at all if there "is not killer > feature", never mind the keybindings? > Maybe they use Eclipse which is a bloated monster, and while they do Java development in it, they want a more efficient editor for their simpler editing needs. Why couldn't Emacs be this editor if it is easy to use casually? (Not having to learn new things to use it.) And if we can get them to use it they may even get to like it and want to learn more about it. > Why would they become contributors when being able to program/contribute > is not attractive (not killer feature) for them? Why would people > bothered by keybindings switch to an editor where they need to > contribute code before it becomes tolerable for them? Most of the new users won't be contributors. They will be simple users who use Emacs for simple tasks. But some percent of them would become contributors who would like to help out if they grow to like Emacs. > So the kind of new users you are trying to attract would likely have a > worse contributor ratio than that. They will have a non-zero whine > factor, however. You'll be more than busy enough catering for their > superficial complaints and feature remapping requests ever to get around > to implementing a killer feature. > You forget one thing: users of popular tools often runs forums and stuff to help out others. So even if not all new users would contribute code they would write blogs, answer questions, etc. so they could even take such load off the core developers and they could concentrate on important issues more. More users means more whiners, but more helping hands too who would help in the janitorial work.