From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?=D3scar_Fuentes?= Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Why Emacs needs a modern bug tracker Date: Sun, 06 Jan 2008 00:05:18 +0100 Message-ID: References: <20080104164454.0A4BD830697@snark.thyrsus.com> <20080104232514.GB2735@muc.de> <20080105122310.GB3014@muc.de> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1199574385 23496 80.91.229.12 (5 Jan 2008 23:06:25 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 5 Jan 2008 23:06:25 +0000 (UTC) To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sun Jan 06 00:06:46 2008 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1JBI6C-0000Ay-L7 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sun, 06 Jan 2008 00:06:45 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1JBI5e-0006GL-8D for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 05 Jan 2008 18:06:06 -0500 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1JBI5Z-0006G9-VC for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 05 Jan 2008 18:06:01 -0500 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1JBI5U-0006Fx-NN for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 05 Jan 2008 18:06:00 -0500 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1JBI5U-0006Fu-Hx for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 05 Jan 2008 18:05:56 -0500 Original-Received: from main.gmane.org ([80.91.229.2] helo=ciao.gmane.org) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS-1.0:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1JBI5R-0003MI-Mv for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 05 Jan 2008 18:05:56 -0500 Original-Received: from list by ciao.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.43) id 1JBI52-0001cP-3r for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 05 Jan 2008 23:05:28 +0000 Original-Received: from 169.red-81-35-77.dynamicip.rima-tde.net ([81.35.77.169]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Sat, 05 Jan 2008 23:05:28 +0000 Original-Received: from ofv by 169.red-81-35-77.dynamicip.rima-tde.net with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Sat, 05 Jan 2008 23:05:28 +0000 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ Original-Lines: 52 Original-X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: 169.red-81-35-77.dynamicip.rima-tde.net User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/23.0.50 (windows-nt) Cancel-Lock: sha1:+Oc0+Zi01Tou0gg6Gf7jwRV+E+s= X-detected-kernel: by monty-python.gnu.org: Linux 2.6, seldom 2.4 (older, 4) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:86254 Archived-At: Alan Mackenzie writes: [snip] > Supremely important is that the new tools must be customizable to suit > the way ANY of us work. Even for the small team of regular committers, I doubt all of you are 100% happy with the tools you are using and would prefer something else for some task. The problem with refusing to give up a bit of your comfort is that you may produce an uncomfortable environment for others. IMHO, one of the problems with Emacs is its failure attracting new hackers. It is clear to me that a DVCS would make Emacs hacking more fun for current project members, and a good bug tracker would be very useful and just a little bit annoying for you. With this facilities, from the outside, Emacs would appear as a more open and participative project. [snip] >> I was thinking about this possibility and concluded that it is not >> possible to build a decent bug-tracking system using only a VCS. The >> reason is the importance of the user interface, which must be open to >> everybody, not only for the committers, as PROBLEMS and TODO are now, >> thus effectively dissuading possible contributions from the outside. > > OK, VCS access IN ADDITION TO web access. How about that? Others just proposed such a system. I'm skeptical about it. So far, it seems quite limiting and for a good reason: >> Furthermore, a bug-tracking system needs a database and a VCS is not >> good at that. > > That is a good argument for staying with an email based system. ;-( > What's the point of a bug system if you have to be online to use it? It > kind of cancels out the benefit of a dVCS for our other files. > > Are you telling me I won't be able to grep a bug-tracking database? If > I'm using such a database, I want instant response when I press to > look at an item. I want to be able to do M-x occur (or the like) on it, > without going through some ghastly GUI interface. I want regexp > searching, filtering with a "command line"-like interface (e.g., like > mutt has), and so on. And I want the database on my own hard disk, for > speed and flexibility. You can request a plain-text export of the database. -- Oscar