From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.ciao.gmane.io!not-for-mail From: Stefan Monnier Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Why mouse-1/2/3 ? Date: Mon, 27 Apr 2020 11:13:05 -0400 Message-ID: References: <871roayjlm.fsf@yahoo.com> <87v9lljmxv.fsf@yahoo.com> <20200427094039.GD30150@tuxteam.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="ciao.gmane.io:159.69.161.202"; logging-data="85609"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) Cc: Po Lu , tomas@tuxteam.de, Emacs developers , Drew Adams , ndame To: Pip Cet Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Mon Apr 27 17:16:48 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1jT5V2-000M8N-A8 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Mon, 27 Apr 2020 17:16:48 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:50704 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jT5V1-0005aG-AL for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Mon, 27 Apr 2020 11:16:47 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:35172) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jT5Rc-0006zx-Ri for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 27 Apr 2020 11:13:20 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jT5Rb-0003Js-NK for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 27 Apr 2020 11:13:16 -0400 Original-Received: from mailscanner.iro.umontreal.ca ([132.204.25.50]:56572) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jT5Rb-0003Jj-8t for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 27 Apr 2020 11:13:15 -0400 Original-Received: from pmg2.iro.umontreal.ca (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by pmg2.iro.umontreal.ca (Proxmox) with ESMTP id ED4AF8107A; Mon, 27 Apr 2020 11:13:13 -0400 (EDT) Original-Received: from mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (unknown [172.31.2.1]) by pmg2.iro.umontreal.ca (Proxmox) with ESMTP id 3B5A380739; Mon, 27 Apr 2020 11:13:12 -0400 (EDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=iro.umontreal.ca; s=mail; t=1588000392; bh=sBLV32sfLbW8VLWdrA9HVIHH1OeumBSdRv+Lfo30Vl4=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:References:Date:In-Reply-To:From; b=IlM3l6BHCzIIN9gkHjd453AWfsxX5MdvLaRmVSboRoy6Zkg0tYHId52NpITTC7pQN EwAnclmZeeQpJAsc9c7quEpC3hgQESt7c7pBa8/uAw7UV5C83ixFQyLS9NO4gSmGxX EMDbHHK4Ts5ld3edkgKeX9/qn3TdJcvCL/zinYKElY+vHUfGl93b3SqaOiQsSwXFXw txWgRZ5MKcQqiL8NkqLJNBhhDxPxdNJV/4dJyz/FuqqcYMAIUlMSHMRN5fb6LAFe3P rG50pN4bcUd753n7VWuiVoi2AFR2vi7I86oDnqMotP5LJy3TDZVrUcCb4Bv5v4cafr 5RMcw3DoaQ5UA== Original-Received: from alfajor (69-165-158-35.dsl.teksavvy.com [69.165.158.35]) by mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id D90FF1201BE; Mon, 27 Apr 2020 11:13:11 -0400 (EDT) In-Reply-To: (Pip Cet's message of "Mon, 27 Apr 2020 09:47:44 +0000") Received-SPF: pass client-ip=132.204.25.50; envelope-from=monnier@iro.umontreal.ca; helo=mailscanner.iro.umontreal.ca X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: First seen = 2020/04/27 10:27:27 X-ACL-Warn: Detected OS = Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 132.204.25.50 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:247935 Archived-At: > As far as I can tell, we're missing one explanation: mice might be on > their way out, people use touch-sensitive surfaces (both the sensible It's more than that: while over the years there have been many different kinds of "mouse" device in use. The terms `mouse-N` aren't wrong: they're just too low-level. In xmodmap's terminology, `mouse-1` is basically a "keycode", i.e. an internal number used to uniquely identify a particular event. Sadly, X11 has never developed any layer on top of that to give meaningful names (aka "keysyms" in xmodmap's terminology) to those numbers. Emacs could invent its own mouse-button-naming layer (so I could name my mouse-4/5 as scroll-wheel-up/down and my mouse-1 as mouse-left, and so people who use a different device could name them differently). We already have the underlying mechanism for that: `input-decode-map` could be used to map `mouse-1` to `mouse-left` (and we could use `function-key-map` to give a fallback default to remap `mouse-left` back to `mouse-1` for backward compatibility). But it's fundamentally a failing of X11, AFAIK. This said, I'm not at all up-to-date on the input-device layers of Linux/X11/Wayland, so maybe there is a good solution out there. Stefan