* Re: [Emacs-diffs] trunk r115058: * lisp/iswitchb.el (iswitchb-mode): Mark ob
@ 2013-11-16 14:02 Xue Fuqiao
2013-11-16 17:25 ` Stefan Monnier
0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: Xue Fuqiao @ 2013-11-16 14:02 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Stefan Monnier, emacs-devel
> revno: 115058
> branch nick: trunk
> timestamp: Sun 2013-11-10 23:50:56 -0500
> message:
> * lisp/iswitchb.el (iswitchb-mode): Mark obsolete.
> modified:
> etc/NEWS news-20100311060928-aoit31wvzf25yr1z-1
> lisp/ChangeLog changelog-20091113204419-o5vbwnq5f7feedwu-1432
> lisp/iswitchb.el
> iswitchb.el-20091113204419-o5vbwnq5f7feedwu-1173
> === modified file 'etc/NEWS'
> --- a/etc/NEWS 2013-11-05 07:44:14 +0000
> +++ b/etc/NEWS 2013-11-11 04:50:56 +0000
> @@ -587,6 +587,8 @@
>
> ** Obsolete packages:
>
> +*** Iswitchb is made obsolete by icomplete-mode.
> +
> *** longlines.el is obsolete; use visual-line-mode instead.
>
> +++
>
> === modified file 'lisp/ChangeLog'
> --- a/lisp/ChangeLog 2013-11-11 00:58:13 +0000
> +++ b/lisp/ChangeLog 2013-11-11 04:50:56 +0000
> @@ -1,3 +1,7 @@
> +2013-11-11 Stefan Monnier <address@hidden>
> +
> + * iswitchb.el (iswitchb-mode): Mark obsolete.
> +
> 2013-11-11 Glenn Morris <address@hidden>
>
> * international/uni-bidi.el, international/uni-category.el:
>
> === modified file 'lisp/iswitchb.el'
> --- a/lisp/iswitchb.el 2013-03-30 16:55:47 +0000
> +++ b/lisp/iswitchb.el 2013-11-11 04:50:56 +0000
> @@ -1427,6 +1427,8 @@
> (add-hook 'minibuffer-setup-hook 'iswitchb-minibuffer-setup)
> (remove-hook 'minibuffer-setup-hook 'iswitchb-minibuffer-setup)))
>
> +(make-obsolete 'iswitchb-mode 'icomplete-mode "24.4")
> +
> (provide 'iswitchb)
>
> ;;; iswitchb.el ends here
Maybe we should also:
* Remove iswitchb in doc/emacs/{buffers, ack, emacs}.texi
* move iswitchb.el to lisp/obsolete/
* Add a `;; Obsolete-since: 24.4' header
IMHO only marking `iswitchb-mode' obsolete isn't enough. People seldom
use other iswitchb-* functions/variables, so we can obsolete the entire
library.
--
http://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: [Emacs-diffs] trunk r115058: * lisp/iswitchb.el (iswitchb-mode): Mark ob 2013-11-16 14:02 [Emacs-diffs] trunk r115058: * lisp/iswitchb.el (iswitchb-mode): Mark ob Xue Fuqiao @ 2013-11-16 17:25 ` Stefan Monnier 2013-11-16 23:07 ` Xue Fuqiao 2013-11-17 0:51 ` Josh 0 siblings, 2 replies; 12+ messages in thread From: Stefan Monnier @ 2013-11-16 17:25 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Xue Fuqiao; +Cc: emacs-devel > * Remove iswitchb in doc/emacs/{buffers, ack, emacs}.texi ..and replace it with icomplete-mode, indeed, yes. > * move iswitchb.el to lisp/obsolete/ > * Add a `;; Obsolete-since: 24.4' header I'm OK with that. But packages in `obsolete' aren't autoloaded (they aren't scanned for ;;;###autoload cookies), and AFAIK many users use iswitchb-mode in their .emacs, so please add an explicit autoload of iswtchb-mode, then (and make sure the autoload's docstring says that it's obsolete). Stefan ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: [Emacs-diffs] trunk r115058: * lisp/iswitchb.el (iswitchb-mode): Mark ob 2013-11-16 17:25 ` Stefan Monnier @ 2013-11-16 23:07 ` Xue Fuqiao 2013-11-17 1:17 ` Stefan Monnier 2013-11-17 5:23 ` Jambunathan K 2013-11-17 0:51 ` Josh 1 sibling, 2 replies; 12+ messages in thread From: Xue Fuqiao @ 2013-11-16 23:07 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Stefan Monnier; +Cc: emacs-devel [-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 726 bytes --] On Sun, Nov 17, 2013 at 1:25 AM, Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> wrote: >> * Remove iswitchb in doc/emacs/{buffers, ack, emacs}.texi > > ..and replace it with icomplete-mode, indeed, yes. icomplete-mode is already documented (although it's brief). >> * move iswitchb.el to lisp/obsolete/ >> * Add a `;; Obsolete-since: 24.4' header > > I'm OK with that. But packages in `obsolete' aren't autoloaded (they > aren't scanned for ;;;###autoload cookies), and AFAIK many users use > iswitchb-mode in their .emacs, so please add an explicit autoload of > iswtchb-mode, then (and make sure the autoload's docstring says that > it's obsolete). OK, what about the following patch? -- http://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/ [-- Attachment #2: obsolete-iswitchb.patch --] [-- Type: text/x-patch, Size: 5051 bytes --] === modified file 'doc/emacs/ChangeLog' --- doc/emacs/ChangeLog 2013-11-04 01:36:14 +0000 +++ doc/emacs/ChangeLog 2013-11-16 22:40:35 +0000 @@ -1,3 +1,9 @@ +2013-11-16 Xue Fuqiao <xfq.free@gmail.com> + + * buffers.texi (Buffer Convenience): + * emacs.texi (Top): + * ack.texi (Acknowledgments): Don't mention iswitchb any more. + 2013-11-04 Glenn Morris <rgm@gnu.org> * cmdargs.texi (Action Arguments): Mention that `-L :...' appends. === modified file 'doc/emacs/ack.texi' --- doc/emacs/ack.texi 2013-10-13 23:01:20 +0000 +++ doc/emacs/ack.texi 2013-11-16 22:40:35 +0000 @@ -303,8 +303,7 @@ @item Stephen Eglen wrote @file{mspools.el}, which tells you which Procmail -folders have mail waiting in them; and @file{iswitchb.el}, a feature -for incremental reading and completion of buffer names. +folders have mail waiting in them. @item Torbjörn Einarsson wrote @file{f90.el}, a mode for Fortran 90 files. === modified file 'doc/emacs/buffers.texi' --- doc/emacs/buffers.texi 2013-01-01 09:11:05 +0000 +++ doc/emacs/buffers.texi 2013-11-16 22:40:35 +0000 @@ -598,7 +598,6 @@ @menu * Uniquify:: Making buffer names unique with directory parts. -* Iswitchb:: Switching between buffers with substrings. * Buffer Menus:: Configurable buffer menu. @end menu @@ -641,41 +640,6 @@ know the rule, you won't have to look. And then you may find that one rule or another is easier for you to remember and apply quickly. -@node Iswitchb -@subsection Switching Between Buffers using Substrings - -@findex iswitchb-mode -@cindex Iswitchb mode -@cindex mode, Iswitchb -@kindex C-x b @r{(Iswitchb mode)} -@kindex C-x 4 b @r{(Iswitchb mode)} -@kindex C-x 5 b @r{(Iswitchb mode)} -@kindex C-x 4 C-o @r{(Iswitchb mode)} - - Iswitchb global minor mode provides convenient switching between -buffers using substrings of their names. It replaces the normal -definitions of @kbd{C-x b}, @kbd{C-x 4 b}, @kbd{C-x 5 b}, and @kbd{C-x -4 C-o} with alternative commands that are somewhat ``smarter''. - - When one of these commands prompts you for a buffer name, you can -type in just a substring of the name you want to choose. As you enter -the substring, Iswitchb mode continuously displays a list of buffers -that match the substring you have typed. - - At any time, you can type @key{RET} to select the first buffer in -the list. So the way to select a particular buffer is to make it the -first in the list. There are two ways to do this. You can type more -of the buffer name and thus narrow down the list, excluding unwanted -buffers above the desired one. Alternatively, you can use @kbd{C-s} -and @kbd{C-r} to rotate the list until the desired buffer is first. - - @key{TAB} while entering the buffer name performs completion on the -string you have entered, based on the displayed list of buffers. - - To enable Iswitchb mode, type @kbd{M-x iswitchb-mode}, or customize -the variable @code{iswitchb-mode} to @code{t} (@pxref{Easy -Customization}). - @node Buffer Menus @subsection Customizing Buffer Menus === modified file 'doc/emacs/emacs.texi' --- doc/emacs/emacs.texi 2013-10-13 00:31:19 +0000 +++ doc/emacs/emacs.texi 2013-11-16 22:40:35 +0000 @@ -501,7 +501,6 @@ Convenience Features and Customization of Buffer Handling * Uniquify:: Making buffer names unique with directory parts. -* Iswitchb:: Switching between buffers with substrings. * Buffer Menus:: Configurable buffer menu. Multiple Windows === modified file 'lisp/ChangeLog' --- lisp/ChangeLog 2013-11-16 11:37:45 +0000 +++ lisp/ChangeLog 2013-11-16 22:43:44 +0000 @@ -1,3 +1,7 @@ +2013-11-16 Xue Fuqiao <xfq.free@gmail.com> + + * iswitchb.el: Move to obsolete/. + 2013-11-16 Michael Albinus <michael.albinus@gmx.de> * net/tramp-cmds.el (tramp-cleanup-connection): Clean up === renamed file 'lisp/iswitchb.el' => 'lisp/obsolete/iswitchb.el' --- lisp/iswitchb.el 2013-11-11 04:50:56 +0000 +++ lisp/obsolete/iswitchb.el 2013-11-16 22:58:50 +0000 @@ -5,6 +5,7 @@ ;; Author: Stephen Eglen <stephen@gnu.org> ;; Maintainer: Stephen Eglen <stephen@gnu.org> ;; Keywords: completion convenience +;; Obsolete-since: 24.4 ;; This file is part of GNU Emacs. @@ -23,6 +24,9 @@ ;;; Commentary: +;; This file is obsolete. For similar functionality, see +;; icomplete.el. + ;; Installation: ;; To get the functions in this package bound to keys, use ;; M-x iswitchb-mode or customize the option `iswitchb-mode'. @@ -243,6 +247,17 @@ (require 'font-lock) +(autoload 'iswitchb-mode "iswitchb-mode" + "This function is obsolete since 24.4; use `icomplete-mode' instead. + +Toggle Iswitchb mode. +With a prefix argument ARG, enable Iswitchb mode if ARG is +positive, and disable it otherwise. If called from Lisp, enable +the mode if ARG is omitted or nil. + +Iswitchb mode is a global minor mode that enables switching +between buffers using substrings. See `iswitchb' for details.") + ;;; User Variables ;; ;; These are some things you might want to change. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: [Emacs-diffs] trunk r115058: * lisp/iswitchb.el (iswitchb-mode): Mark ob 2013-11-16 23:07 ` Xue Fuqiao @ 2013-11-17 1:17 ` Stefan Monnier 2013-11-17 3:13 ` Xue Fuqiao 2013-11-17 5:23 ` Jambunathan K 1 sibling, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread From: Stefan Monnier @ 2013-11-17 1:17 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Xue Fuqiao; +Cc: emacs-devel > OK, what about the following patch? Looks OK, except for the autoload which can't work. Stefan ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: [Emacs-diffs] trunk r115058: * lisp/iswitchb.el (iswitchb-mode): Mark ob 2013-11-17 1:17 ` Stefan Monnier @ 2013-11-17 3:13 ` Xue Fuqiao 0 siblings, 0 replies; 12+ messages in thread From: Xue Fuqiao @ 2013-11-17 3:13 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Stefan Monnier; +Cc: emacs-devel On Sun, Nov 17, 2013 at 9:17 AM, Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> wrote: >> OK, what about the following patch? > > Looks OK, except for the autoload which can't work. Thanks. Why can't the autoload work? It's in the wrong place? -- http://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/ ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: [Emacs-diffs] trunk r115058: * lisp/iswitchb.el (iswitchb-mode): Mark ob 2013-11-16 23:07 ` Xue Fuqiao 2013-11-17 1:17 ` Stefan Monnier @ 2013-11-17 5:23 ` Jambunathan K 1 sibling, 0 replies; 12+ messages in thread From: Jambunathan K @ 2013-11-17 5:23 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Xue Fuqiao; +Cc: Stefan Monnier, emacs-devel Xue Fuqiao <xfq.free@gmail.com> writes: > icomplete-mode is already documented (although it's brief). Creating a separate node for icomplete-mode will give it more exposure and testing. +1 for obsoleting iswitchb. I hope, some day, parts of ido-mode get sucked in to the completion infrastructure as well. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: [Emacs-diffs] trunk r115058: * lisp/iswitchb.el (iswitchb-mode): Mark ob 2013-11-16 17:25 ` Stefan Monnier 2013-11-16 23:07 ` Xue Fuqiao @ 2013-11-17 0:51 ` Josh 2013-11-17 1:24 ` Stefan Monnier 1 sibling, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread From: Josh @ 2013-11-17 0:51 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Stefan Monnier; +Cc: Xue Fuqiao, emacs-devel On Sat, Nov 16, 2013 at 9:25 AM, Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> wrote: >> * Remove iswitchb in doc/emacs/{buffers, ack, emacs}.texi > > ..and replace it with icomplete-mode, indeed, yes. Did I miss a discussion somewhere about obsoleting iswitchb and replacing it with icomplete? The obsolescence itself is a little surprising to me, as I personally know of a few people who prefer it to more featureful alternatives, but far more surprising to me is the designation of icomplete as its successor instead of ido. It's my impression that ido is _far_ more widely used than icomplete. That impression is based on how very frequently ido is recommended or inquired about on #emacs, in stark contrast to icomplete, which is recommended or inquired about there approximately never. The last mention of icomplete in my logs (which do have some holes) was on August 23, nearly three months ago; the last mention of ido was yesterday. Josh ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: [Emacs-diffs] trunk r115058: * lisp/iswitchb.el (iswitchb-mode): Mark ob 2013-11-17 0:51 ` Josh @ 2013-11-17 1:24 ` Stefan Monnier 2013-11-17 2:24 ` Josh 0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread From: Stefan Monnier @ 2013-11-17 1:24 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Josh; +Cc: Xue Fuqiao, emacs-devel > Did I miss a discussion somewhere about obsoleting iswitchb and > replacing it with icomplete? It's a simple fact that since the default C-x b now does substring completion by default (since 24.3, IIRC), and since icomplete-mode now provides the few extra commands to "rotate" the list of completions, it now makes iswitchb-mode obsolete, AFAIK. > The obsolescence itself is a little surprising to me, as I personally > know of a few people who prefer it to more featureful alternatives, > but far more surprising to me is the designation of icomplete as its > successor instead of ido. It's my impression that ido is _far_ more > widely used than icomplete. icomplete-mode does not make ido-mode obsolete, indeed, far from it. And if people want to use it, ido-mode is just as available as before. Stefan ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: [Emacs-diffs] trunk r115058: * lisp/iswitchb.el (iswitchb-mode): Mark ob 2013-11-17 1:24 ` Stefan Monnier @ 2013-11-17 2:24 ` Josh 2013-11-17 20:45 ` Stefan Monnier 0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread From: Josh @ 2013-11-17 2:24 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Stefan Monnier; +Cc: Xue Fuqiao, emacs-devel On Sat, Nov 16, 2013 at 5:24 PM, Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> wrote: > >> The obsolescence itself is a little surprising to me, as I personally >> know of a few people who prefer it to more featureful alternatives, >> but far more surprising to me is the designation of icomplete as its >> successor instead of ido. It's my impression that ido is _far_ more >> widely used than icomplete. > > icomplete-mode does not make ido-mode obsolete, indeed, far from it. > And if people want to use it, ido-mode is just as available as before. You misunderstood. It is iswitchb's obsolescence that surprises me, and iswitchb that those few people I mentioned prefer. Leaving that aside, if iswitchb is to be obsoleted then ido seems like a far more sensible successor because people seem to prefer it to icomplete by a wide margin. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: [Emacs-diffs] trunk r115058: * lisp/iswitchb.el (iswitchb-mode): Mark ob 2013-11-17 2:24 ` Josh @ 2013-11-17 20:45 ` Stefan Monnier 2013-11-18 1:32 ` Josh 0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread From: Stefan Monnier @ 2013-11-17 20:45 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Josh; +Cc: Xue Fuqiao, emacs-devel > You misunderstood. It is iswitchb's obsolescence that surprises me, > and iswitchb that those few people I mentioned prefer. Then, please make a bug-report explaining why they prefer iswitchb-mode over icomplete-mode. The two are not 100% identical, but it should be possible to configure icomplete-mode's behavior to be pretty close to iswitchb-mode. Stefan ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: [Emacs-diffs] trunk r115058: * lisp/iswitchb.el (iswitchb-mode): Mark ob 2013-11-17 20:45 ` Stefan Monnier @ 2013-11-18 1:32 ` Josh 2013-11-18 13:25 ` Stefan Monnier 0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread From: Josh @ 2013-11-18 1:32 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Stefan Monnier; +Cc: Xue Fuqiao, emacs-devel On Sun, Nov 17, 2013 at 12:45 PM, Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> wrote: >> You misunderstood. It is iswitchb's obsolescence that surprises me, >> and iswitchb that those few people I mentioned prefer. > > Then, please make a bug-report explaining why they prefer iswitchb-mode > over icomplete-mode. The two are not 100% identical, but it should be > possible to configure icomplete-mode's behavior to be pretty close to > iswitchb-mode. They can do it themselves if they are so moved. As I hope I've made clear by now, my main concern is the question of whether iswitchb's successor ought to be icomplete or ido. I have put forward an argument that it should be ido based on the fact that it appears to be far and away what users prefer, and by going this route we would maximize the number of users who were satisfied with the default completion mechanism. With my argument I offered evidence, and I believe and hope that one of the many here who also frequent #emacs and keep their own logs would swiftly correct me if I have misstated the reality. If I have not, is there some countervailing argument or evidence you believe tips the scale in favor of annointing icomplete, or are you just asserting maintainer's privilege because you personally prefer icomplete? ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: [Emacs-diffs] trunk r115058: * lisp/iswitchb.el (iswitchb-mode): Mark ob 2013-11-18 1:32 ` Josh @ 2013-11-18 13:25 ` Stefan Monnier 0 siblings, 0 replies; 12+ messages in thread From: Stefan Monnier @ 2013-11-18 13:25 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Josh; +Cc: Xue Fuqiao, emacs-devel > They can do it themselves if they are so moved. As I hope I've made > clear by now, my main concern is the question of whether iswitchb's > successor ought to be icomplete or ido. We can't tell iswitchb users that ido makes iswitchb obsolete, since ido does a lot more and maybe they don't want all that extra functionality (and I'm not sure to what extend ido can be configured to behave like iswitchb does). I assume that if they're still using iswitchb by now, it's because they indeed don't want ido. Stefan ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
end of thread, other threads:[~2013-11-18 13:25 UTC | newest] Thread overview: 12+ messages (download: mbox.gz follow: Atom feed -- links below jump to the message on this page -- 2013-11-16 14:02 [Emacs-diffs] trunk r115058: * lisp/iswitchb.el (iswitchb-mode): Mark ob Xue Fuqiao 2013-11-16 17:25 ` Stefan Monnier 2013-11-16 23:07 ` Xue Fuqiao 2013-11-17 1:17 ` Stefan Monnier 2013-11-17 3:13 ` Xue Fuqiao 2013-11-17 5:23 ` Jambunathan K 2013-11-17 0:51 ` Josh 2013-11-17 1:24 ` Stefan Monnier 2013-11-17 2:24 ` Josh 2013-11-17 20:45 ` Stefan Monnier 2013-11-18 1:32 ` Josh 2013-11-18 13:25 ` Stefan Monnier
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