From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: Stefan Monnier Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#24340: insert-file-contents calls before-change-functions too late Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2016 10:48:09 -0400 Message-ID: References: <8360qim5sv.fsf@gnu.org> <83vayhkogv.fsf@gnu.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: blaine.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Trace: blaine.gmane.org 1472654795 868 195.159.176.226 (31 Aug 2016 14:46:35 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@blaine.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2016 14:46:35 +0000 (UTC) User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/25.1.50 (gnu/linux) Cc: 24340@debbugs.gnu.org To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Wed Aug 31 16:46:26 2016 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bf6mR-0007PQ-CB for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Wed, 31 Aug 2016 16:46:19 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:54485 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bf6mP-0004S0-4S for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Wed, 31 Aug 2016 10:46:17 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:55622) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bf6mG-0004Rr-2v for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 31 Aug 2016 10:46:12 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bf6mA-0004V9-GS for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 31 Aug 2016 10:46:07 -0400 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.43]:47848) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bf6mA-0004V4-CJ for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 31 Aug 2016 10:46:02 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bf6mA-0000KS-7w for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 31 Aug 2016 10:46:02 -0400 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Stefan Monnier Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2016 14:46:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 24340 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: Original-Received: via spool by 24340-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B24340.14726547241213 (code B ref 24340); Wed, 31 Aug 2016 14:46:02 +0000 Original-Received: (at 24340) by debbugs.gnu.org; 31 Aug 2016 14:45:24 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:45559 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bf6lS-0000JN-CK for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 31 Aug 2016 10:45:24 -0400 Original-Received: from ironport2-out.teksavvy.com ([206.248.154.181]:34401) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bf6lK-0000J4-Rt for 24340@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 31 Aug 2016 10:45:16 -0400 X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: A0ByEgCJI6tX/+V1oWxdGwEBAYMnhEuFULJahhcEAgKBXTwRAQEBAQEBAV0nhF8BAQMBViMFCws0EhQYDSSIPAjBXAEBAQEGAiWKd4l+HQWZPJhZhXyOcIE8NCCCEhyBaCCHXgEBAQ X-IPAS-Result: A0ByEgCJI6tX/+V1oWxdGwEBAYMnhEuFULJahhcEAgKBXTwRAQEBAQEBAV0nhF8BAQMBViMFCws0EhQYDSSIPAjBXAEBAQEGAiWKd4l+HQWZPJhZhXyOcIE8NCCCEhyBaCCHXgEBAQ X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.28,500,1464667200"; d="scan'208";a="270429804" Original-Received: from 108-161-117-229.dsl.teksavvy.com (HELO ceviche.home) ([108.161.117.229]) by smtp.teksavvy.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 31 Aug 2016 10:45:05 -0400 Original-Received: by ceviche.home (Postfix, from userid 20848) id BBFCB66287; Wed, 31 Aug 2016 10:48:09 -0400 (EDT) In-Reply-To: <83vayhkogv.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Wed, 31 Aug 2016 17:22:24 +0300") X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 208.118.235.43 X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "bug-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.bugs:122802 Archived-At: > I'm sorry, but I must insist. The change I proposed is the only one > in insert-file-contents for that use case that I'm prepared to > consider in the current situation. (We could also leave this bug > open, until such time as a more thorough refactoring is done of the > related functionalities.) Deeper changes are exactly the can of worms > that I don't want to open to fix just this one use case, especially > since Emacs 25.2 will almost certainly be branched from what now is > the master branch. Such deeper changes were what Alan proposed in the > first place (with a similar patch), and I already said I didn't want > to do that. Right: I do not intend for my patch to go to 25.2. But for Emacs-26, it seems there's plenty of time to find and fix any possible fallout. > I think a cleaner way is to change the model of how we partition > piecemeal changes, when we signal the changes and when don't, when we > ask the user about supersession-threat, etc. The current model is > fundamentally flawed, if we want to use the buffer-change hooks in the > ways that emerged from these discussions. All I care about is for any change to the buffer to be announced by a prior b-c-f. Stefan