From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Stefan Monnier Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Generators (iterators) for Gnu Emacs Date: Sun, 07 Dec 2014 11:51:04 -0500 Message-ID: References: <877fy77zhp.fsf@web.de> <87k326d4ww.fsf@gmail.com> <877fy6rp2o.fsf@web.de> <548230FB.40307@dancol.org> <5482C872.5010304@dancol.org> <5483C537.3010707@dancol.org> <54840719.5080209@dancol.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1417971093 27942 80.91.229.3 (7 Dec 2014 16:51:33 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2014 16:51:33 +0000 (UTC) Cc: Michael Heerdegen , emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Daniel Colascione Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sun Dec 07 17:51:27 2014 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Xxf3N-0003Ek-Sx for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sun, 07 Dec 2014 17:51:26 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:58462 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Xxf3N-000765-Fs for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sun, 07 Dec 2014 11:51:25 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:51904) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Xxf3B-0006vy-S9 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 07 Dec 2014 11:51:21 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Xxf34-0000nK-DR for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 07 Dec 2014 11:51:13 -0500 Original-Received: from ironport2-out.teksavvy.com ([206.248.154.181]:31256) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Xxf34-0000nA-9b for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 07 Dec 2014 11:51:06 -0500 X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AjwPAOwQflRMCqTq/2dsb2JhbABbgweDYIVaxR0EAgKBJBcBAQEBAQF8hAMBAQMBViMFCwsOJhIUGA0kiEoJ1lkBAQEBBgEBAQEekG8HhEgFiwGSMY9zggqBeIQZIYJ3AQEB X-IPAS-Result: AjwPAOwQflRMCqTq/2dsb2JhbABbgweDYIVaxR0EAgKBJBcBAQEBAQF8hAMBAQMBViMFCwsOJhIUGA0kiEoJ1lkBAQEBBgEBAQEekG8HhEgFiwGSMY9zggqBeIQZIYJ3AQEB X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.07,502,1413259200"; d="scan'208";a="99794602" Original-Received: from 76-10-164-234.dsl.teksavvy.com (HELO pastel.home) ([76.10.164.234]) by ironport2-out.teksavvy.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 07 Dec 2014 11:51:04 -0500 Original-Received: by pastel.home (Postfix, from userid 20848) id 949E985F7; Sun, 7 Dec 2014 11:51:04 -0500 (EST) In-Reply-To: <54840719.5080209@dancol.org> (Daniel Colascione's message of "Sat, 06 Dec 2014 23:51:53 -0800") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/25.0.50 (gnu/linux) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Genre and OS details not recognized. X-Received-From: 206.248.154.181 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:179278 Archived-At: > And you're really not interested in a discussion of your motives or the > circumstance under which you'd make an exception, are you? I think we've already discussed it at length in the cl-lib era. It's largely an aesthetic issue: you want to save those 4 "gen-" characters, whereas I want to keep the namespace clean. As mentioned I also want to keep things discoverable and modular, and given the lack of real modules, using a "gen-" prefix is the way to make things discoverable and modular. Note that when I code in languages with good module systems, I still use "prefixes", tho instead of "gen-" it would probably be shortened to "G." or something like that. As can be seen with the seq.el library, I want to move towards *more* use of prefixes even for "core" functionality. This has been the case for many many years. Even back in Emacs-21 times, my newcomment.el did that, taking non-namespace-clean code from simple.el (or maybe it was subr.el, can't remember) and making it use "comment-". Over the years, my belief in the importance of using such prefixes has only strengthened. I know many people disagree, but at this point there's really not much room for negotiation. We should simply agree to disagree. Stefan PS: In the case of "next", we could solve the namespace issue without modules if Elisp had an equivalent to "foo.next". But the only OO-style system we have uses methods which have global scope, so we'd need another object system with a different method-call syntax like maybe (foo :next).