Re: Adding AUCTeX to core Re: Why not include all ELPA packages in an Emacs release?

[Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca>]

>> I really do want to see Emacs growing its build setup so it can bundle
>> ELPA packages like AUCTeX.  But that should not require any change on
>> the part of AUCTeX.  The benefit being that end users will get AUCTeX
>> support without having to download and install the package.
> This comes at the disadvantage of inconveniencing Emacs users who buikd
> Emacs from the git repository,

I don't see any reason to expect this would be any worse than what we
have currently with all the other packages we have in core.
And if an ELPA package fails to build, you can always re-set it to
a previous commit, or build without ELPA packages.

> unless AUCTeX take pains to coordinate with us, by, for instance,
> designating versions that are "safe" for inclusion in Emacs, and
> responding to reports of build failures and the like, which nullifies
> the stated advantage to them.

Telling us which versions are "safe" is already what maintainers do when
they bump the version number, so it's not necessarily extra work.
And it's much less work than sync'ing changes between two branches with
unrelated history, like what the Org guys do, what the CEDET guys
tried to do (and failed doing), what the Gnus guys did (and stopped
doing at some point), what Alan does with CC-mode, etc...

>> In comparison migrating AUCTeX into Emacs would require significant
>> extra work on the part of AUCTeX with no extra benefit for the end
>> users.
> This extra work is invested once,

Only if the `emacs.git` code becomes the one and only maintained code.
Otherwise there's an on-going requirement to keep thr `emacs.git` code
in-sync with some external branch without being able to use tools like
`git merge`, so it's a rather unexciting manual work.

> Meanwhile bundling ELPA packages in core remains a castle in the air,

Very much so.

> and its advantages and deficiencies are not nearly so absolute
> or well-understood as it is implied.  So please don't deal in absolutes.

If I "dealt in absolutes" it was indeed a mistake.  But I do know about
the pain of keeping separate branches in sync and I want to provide
a way to bundle packages without that extra pain.
Nothing is a pure gain, so it'll come with its own compromises of course.


        Stefan