From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Stefan Monnier via "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#45333: complex command history should not save optional nil parameters Date: Thu, 07 Jul 2022 11:05:02 -0400 Message-ID: References: <0DJzRuBn1S9jW_MoJt5HXcLQWrzb7Vjkfmlwa9zPvgLIFeEfdPLoiguSztbL4TnuHyxd59Z7BpS9qJo5BinMO3n1mDlWjcytLjq9HmoGIl0=@protonmail.com> <8735ggk7nz.fsf@gnus.org> <83ee007gxo.fsf@gnu.org> <87o7z3bcsp.fsf@gnus.org> <875ykbabl1.fsf@web.de> <87o7y31pho.fsf@gnus.org> <87wncrs8js.fsf@web.de> <87sfnfmm41.fsf@gnus.org> <87k08rs7jg.fsf@web.de> <87bku3ml4x.fsf@gnus.org> <87fsjfs5v2.fsf@web.de> <871quzmj9a.fsf@gnus.org> <87o7y3l1xm.fsf@gnus.org> <87v8s9idnx.fsf@gnus.org> <87sfndf1xp.fsf@gnus.org> <87o7y1f016.fsf@gnus.org> Reply-To: Stefan Monnier Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="18182"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) Cc: Michael Heerdegen , laszlomail@protonmail.com, Eli Zaretskii , 45333@debbugs.gnu.org To: Lars Ingebrigtsen Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Thu Jul 07 17:06:15 2022 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1o9T55-0004WU-DV for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 07 Jul 2022 17:06:15 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:38672 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1o9T54-0000vK-9r for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 07 Jul 2022 11:06:14 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:52636) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1o9T4s-0000sb-HP for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; 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Thu, 7 Jul 2022 11:05:03 -0400 (EDT) In-Reply-To: <87o7y1f016.fsf@gnus.org> (Lars Ingebrigtsen's message of "Thu, 07 Jul 2022 16:52:05 +0200") X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "bug-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.bugs:236381 Archived-At: Lars Ingebrigtsen [2022-07-07 16:52:05] wrote: > Stefan Monnier writes: >> Sorry, both (foo [bar zot] ...) and "doing low level stuff" sound a bit >> too hypothetical for me to get a sense of what we're talking about. >> >> More specifically I don't know of any use of advertized signature that >> presents the args with a [...] notation, > > --- > setq is a special form in src/eval.c. > > (setq [SYM VAL]...) > --- Ah, so you're not talking about advertised-calling-convention!? >> and I can't remember ever needing a pretty arglist when working on >> "low-level stuff". > You don't need the pretty arglist, but it can be informative. Usually in those cases I look at the source, which is even more informative. Clearly, there is some info we "throw away" or make harder to get to, but to the extent that you can get it back by visiting the source code, I don't see a good reason to spend much effort trying to cater to those very rare needs. Basically, if we want to go there, we start to want to distinguish between: - the "final and pretty" advertized arglist - the "final and pretty" arglist but disregarding advertised-calling-convention - the original arglist rather than the one stashed in the docstring. - the raw arglist seen by the interpreter. I doubt very many chunks of code will know which level to choose (and even fewer will have a good justification for that choice). Stefan