* bug#24802: emacs -Q -nw loads cl-lib @ 2016-10-26 16:40 Glenn Morris 2016-10-26 18:34 ` Eli Zaretskii 0 siblings, 1 reply; 5+ messages in thread From: Glenn Morris @ 2016-10-26 16:40 UTC (permalink / raw) To: 24802 Package: emacs Version: 26.0.50 Current trunk on GNU/Linux in an xterm: emacs -Q -nw (featurep 'cl-lib) -> t I believe this is because term/xterm.el now requires cl-lib at run-time. You might want to consider: i) Preload cl-lib - see previous discussions in list archives. ii) Make term/*.el subject to same rules as files that are explicitly listed in loadup.el - ie no requirements beyond those of loadup. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 5+ messages in thread
* bug#24802: emacs -Q -nw loads cl-lib 2016-10-26 16:40 bug#24802: emacs -Q -nw loads cl-lib Glenn Morris @ 2016-10-26 18:34 ` Eli Zaretskii 2016-10-30 23:49 ` Glenn Morris 0 siblings, 1 reply; 5+ messages in thread From: Eli Zaretskii @ 2016-10-26 18:34 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Glenn Morris; +Cc: 24802 > From: Glenn Morris <rgm@gnu.org> > Date: Wed, 26 Oct 2016 12:40:16 -0400 > > emacs -Q -nw > (featurep 'cl-lib) -> t > > I believe this is because term/xterm.el now requires cl-lib at run-time. > > You might want to consider: > > i) Preload cl-lib - see previous discussions in list archives. > > ii) Make term/*.el subject to same rules as files that are explicitly > listed in loadup.el - ie no requirements beyond those of loadup. But why is it bad that a specific file loaded only by some sessions needs to load cl-lib? Maybe I'm missing something, but I don't see anything wrong here that needs to be fixed. E.g., how is it different from, say, starting to compose email, which then causes message.el to load half a dozen of additional packages? ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 5+ messages in thread
* bug#24802: emacs -Q -nw loads cl-lib 2016-10-26 18:34 ` Eli Zaretskii @ 2016-10-30 23:49 ` Glenn Morris 2016-10-31 15:45 ` Eli Zaretskii 0 siblings, 1 reply; 5+ messages in thread From: Glenn Morris @ 2016-10-30 23:49 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Eli Zaretskii; +Cc: 24802 I'm saying that simply starting Emacs (and no more) should not load any extra libraries beyond those of loadup [1]. This is obviously not comparable to starting Emacs and then doing some arbitrary operation, like composing a mail. As you said in http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-devel/2015-10/msg00095.html Up until now, the rules for pre-loading package X were that either (a) some preloaded package requires X, or (b) X will be auto-loaded at the beginning of every session by some very frequent operation, like visiting the first file or creating a window or a frame. Here we have case b), without needing any operation at all. OK, it's not "every session", it's "every -nw session in an xterm-like terminal", but IMO the same should apply. [1] I don't count the actual term/*.el files themselves in this, because those that aren't preloaded have traditionally been trivial. Perhaps xterm.el has become so large, and is used (I guess) in such a large fraction of without-x builds, that it should be preloaded in such builds, as x-win.el is in with-x builds. I think that's a separate issue though. It would however make the issue in this report obvious. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 5+ messages in thread
* bug#24802: emacs -Q -nw loads cl-lib 2016-10-30 23:49 ` Glenn Morris @ 2016-10-31 15:45 ` Eli Zaretskii 2017-09-02 13:31 ` Eli Zaretskii 0 siblings, 1 reply; 5+ messages in thread From: Eli Zaretskii @ 2016-10-31 15:45 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Glenn Morris; +Cc: 24802 > From: Glenn Morris <rgm@gnu.org> > Cc: 24802@debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Sun, 30 Oct 2016 19:49:26 -0400 > > As you said in > > http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-devel/2015-10/msg00095.html > > Up until now, the rules for pre-loading package X were that either > (a) some preloaded package requires X, or (b) X will be > auto-loaded at the beginning of every session by some very > frequent operation, like visiting the first file or creating a > window or a frame. > > Here we have case b), without needing any operation at all. > > OK, it's not "every session", it's "every -nw session in an > xterm-like terminal", but IMO the same should apply. > > [1] I don't count the actual term/*.el files themselves in this, > because those that aren't preloaded have traditionally been trivial. > Perhaps xterm.el has become so large, and is used (I guess) in such a > large fraction of without-x builds, that it should be preloaded in > such builds, as x-win.el is in with-x builds. I think that's a > separate issue though. It would however make the issue in this report > obvious. That's exactly my line of reasoning: as long as we don't preload xterm.el, we shouldn't regard its loading of other files a problem. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 5+ messages in thread
* bug#24802: emacs -Q -nw loads cl-lib 2016-10-31 15:45 ` Eli Zaretskii @ 2017-09-02 13:31 ` Eli Zaretskii 0 siblings, 0 replies; 5+ messages in thread From: Eli Zaretskii @ 2017-09-02 13:31 UTC (permalink / raw) To: rgm; +Cc: 24802-done > Date: Mon, 31 Oct 2016 17:45:16 +0200 > From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> > Cc: 24802@debbugs.gnu.org > > > From: Glenn Morris <rgm@gnu.org> > > Cc: 24802@debbugs.gnu.org > > Date: Sun, 30 Oct 2016 19:49:26 -0400 > > > > As you said in > > > > http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-devel/2015-10/msg00095.html > > > > Up until now, the rules for pre-loading package X were that either > > (a) some preloaded package requires X, or (b) X will be > > auto-loaded at the beginning of every session by some very > > frequent operation, like visiting the first file or creating a > > window or a frame. > > > > Here we have case b), without needing any operation at all. > > > > OK, it's not "every session", it's "every -nw session in an > > xterm-like terminal", but IMO the same should apply. > > > > [1] I don't count the actual term/*.el files themselves in this, > > because those that aren't preloaded have traditionally been trivial. > > Perhaps xterm.el has become so large, and is used (I guess) in such a > > large fraction of without-x builds, that it should be preloaded in > > such builds, as x-win.el is in with-x builds. I think that's a > > separate issue though. It would however make the issue in this report > > obvious. > > That's exactly my line of reasoning: as long as we don't preload > xterm.el, we shouldn't regard its loading of other files a problem. In any case, your recipe yields nil with the current master, so even if you disagree with the above reasoning, the original problem is now gone, and I'm therefore closing this bug report. Thanks. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 5+ messages in thread
end of thread, other threads:[~2017-09-02 13:31 UTC | newest] Thread overview: 5+ messages (download: mbox.gz follow: Atom feed -- links below jump to the message on this page -- 2016-10-26 16:40 bug#24802: emacs -Q -nw loads cl-lib Glenn Morris 2016-10-26 18:34 ` Eli Zaretskii 2016-10-30 23:49 ` Glenn Morris 2016-10-31 15:45 ` Eli Zaretskii 2017-09-02 13:31 ` Eli Zaretskii
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