From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Richard Riley Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: emacs-w3m question Date: Mon, 03 Nov 2008 13:13:39 +0100 Message-ID: References: <87vdvdu4mp.fsf@literaturlatenight.de> <74160b46-e541-436a-a776-c8bd53d6cd55@o4g2000pra.googlegroups.com> <200810302125.m9ULP2AB006684@zogzog.maillard.mobi> <87bpx1g23o.fsf@gmail.com> <200811031125.mA3BPKiH024523@zogzog.maillard.mobi> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1225714924 20104 80.91.229.12 (3 Nov 2008 12:22:04 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 3 Nov 2008 12:22:04 +0000 (UTC) Cc: Richard Riley , help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org To: Xavier Maillard Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Mon Nov 03 13:23:05 2008 connect(): Connection refused Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1KwySD-00066z-9E for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Mon, 03 Nov 2008 13:22:45 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:45513 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1KwyR6-0003wB-3E for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Mon, 03 Nov 2008 07:21:36 -0500 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1KwyJs-00005f-NJ for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 03 Nov 2008 07:14:08 -0500 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1KwyJm-0008VZ-41 for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 03 Nov 2008 07:14:07 -0500 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=55730 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1KwyJl-0008VW-Th for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 03 Nov 2008 07:14:01 -0500 Original-Received: from qb-out-0506.google.com ([72.14.204.228]:1498) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1KwyJi-0001GL-9j; Mon, 03 Nov 2008 07:13:58 -0500 Original-Received: by qb-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id e12so3051547qba.0 for ; Mon, 03 Nov 2008 04:13:52 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlemail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:to:cc:subject:references:date :in-reply-to:message-id:user-agent:mime-version:content-type:from; bh=vBQtO01iH/r5Cku+7PEF/ZI0H+QEU3yUXHN0QWbBRvw=; b=avb9EKPNZAPjzI0zPK0WFZXxDnaIW9WDTOFJ5C+8N4yvlZxLfRjHuihBYUsBWY/m6O NbrDTzqDUTlVnMjRifwSjrbnAlyeoDkj8qKe/eHFLayTxcI9BiRnP03AcYZ9n5xGBbH0 DFbsSls2h/8fgOilg9Uaqj6qjDvY+PcAkvYRY= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlemail.com; s=gamma; h=to:cc:subject:references:date:in-reply-to:message-id:user-agent :mime-version:content-type:from; b=NKlmZX/jYXCS1mi3GEJOl0JX+4AMNsPT0FtNhxVAhT6Rbs06Rm/bySPuhDvvGkUB4k 8xroFaGNhC7+Cr67nWQSWDqcZg57uyo6OTekxx0sORlyQlSR4unjX/Bw5f0353cIOJCF mSF9bIWA0resQ11Sr6TX+uxydZYe6Br9lvm20= Original-Received: by 10.86.26.1 with SMTP id 1mr97249fgz.29.1225714431954; Mon, 03 Nov 2008 04:13:51 -0800 (PST) Original-Received: from localhost (e179194248.adsl.alicedsl.de [85.179.194.248]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id 12sm8437499fgg.0.2008.11.03.04.13.49 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Mon, 03 Nov 2008 04:13:50 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <200811031125.mA3BPKiH024523@zogzog.maillard.mobi> (Xavier Maillard's message of "Mon, 3 Nov 2008 12:25:20 +0100") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/23.0.60 (gnu/linux) X-detected-operating-system: by monty-python.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 2) X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.help:59380 Archived-At: Xavier Maillard writes: > Xavier Maillard writes: > > > Xavier> For your information, many old computers do not have > > Xavier> Up/Down/Left/Right keys thus making this as a default won't work > > Xavier> for them. I never use these key due to my habits. Therefor > > Xavier> I strongly disagree with you on that point. > > > > Defaults are for newcomers to quickly get hands on the thing. > > > > I do not see why defaults should apply to newcomers, really. > > Defaults must apply to the mass (either power users or newcomers). > > > > Xavier > > The mass have arrow keys. As do 99.99999999999999999% of all new comers. > > Yes I have it on my laptop but I never used them because they are > located to an improbable and unpractical location. > > Xavier With all due respect, the location of the arrow keys on one laptop seem a dubious pivot for making decisions for a configurable base product which is aimed at a wide and varied user base. The great majority have arrow keys, the HW manufacturers built them in ( I haven't seen a keyboard without them for years). To ignore them because of a minorities poorly designed, antiquated or specialised HW seems somewhat silly. Are they the *best* things for hard core Emacs user? Possibly not. Would a lot of users be confused if they did not work as common sense dictates? Almost certainly. Having said that, I'm sure you are not arguing against configuring them.