bug#12467: 24.1; customization initialization confusing

bug#12467: 24.1; customization initialization confusing

[Robert Horn]

This bug report will be sent to the Bug-GNU-Emacs mailing list
and the GNU bug tracker at debbugs.gnu.org.  Please check that
the From: line contains a valid email address.  After a delay of up
to one day, you should receive an acknowledgement at that address.

Please write in English if possible, as the Emacs maintainers
usually do not have translators for other languages.

Please describe exactly what actions triggered the bug, and
the precise symptoms of the bug.  If you can, give a recipe
starting from `emacs -Q':

I found a confusing behaviour for customization.  To trigger the
behavior, assign a value of "t" to org-habit-show-all-today.  What I
found is:

 - If you start emacs and immediately go into *shell* and print org-habit-show-today-all you get an error because that variable has not yet been bound.
: Debugger entered--Lisp error: (void-variable org-habit-show-all-today)
:   (print org-habit-show-all-today)
:   eval((print org-habit-show-all-today) nil)
:   eval-last-sexp-1(t)
:   eval-last-sexp(t)
:   eval-print-last-sexp()
:   call-interactively(eval-print-last-sexp nil nil) 
  - If you start emacs and immediately go into options->config for org-habit, the org-habit-show-today-all will indicate that it has been set outside of the customization system when the customized value is "t".  When the customized value is "nil" there is no indicated problem.
  - If you start emacs and put a buffer into org mode, the (print
  org-habit-show-all) will show the customized value, and the
  options->config will also show the customized value.

This behavior is not documented, which would be one fix.  But a naive
user would expect that starting the customization process for the group
would also cause processing of the startup customization.

In GNU Emacs 24.1.1 (x86_64-unknown-linux-gnu, GTK+ Version 2.24.7)
 of 2012-08-02 on quad
Windowing system distributor `The X.Org Foundation', version 11.0.11004000
Important settings:
  value of $LC_ALL: nil
  value of $LC_COLLATE: nil
  value of $LC_CTYPE: nil
  value of $LC_MESSAGES: nil
  value of $LC_MONETARY: nil
  value of $LC_NUMERIC: nil
  value of $LC_TIME: nil
  value of $LANG: en_US.UTF-8
  value of $XMODIFIERS: nil
  locale-coding-system: utf-8-unix
  default enable-multibyte-characters: t

Major mode: Lisp Interaction

Minor modes in effect:
  shell-dirtrack-mode: t
  diff-auto-refine-mode: t
  tooltip-mode: t
  mouse-wheel-mode: t
  menu-bar-mode: t
  file-name-shadow-mode: t
  global-font-lock-mode: t
  font-lock-mode: t
  auto-composition-mode: t
  auto-encryption-mode: t
  auto-compression-mode: t
  line-number-mode: t
  transient-mark-mode: t

Recent input:
<help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> 
<help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> 
<help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> 
<help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> 
<menu-bar> <options> <customize> <customize-group> 
o r g - h a b i t <return> <down-mouse-5> <mouse-5> 
C-x C-g C-g C-c a h d <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> 
<help-echo> <Scroll_Lock> <Scroll_Lock> <help-echo> 
<help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> 
<help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> 
<help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> C-x 
C-c C-c a h d <help-echo> <down-mouse-1> <mouse-1> 
<up> <down> <down> <down> <down> <down> <down> <up> 
<up> <up> <up> <up> <up> <up> <up> <up> <up> <up> <up> 
<up> <up> <down> <up> <up> <down> <up> <up> <up> <help-echo> 
<help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> 
<help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> 
<help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> 
<help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <down-mouse-4> 
<mouse-4> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <help-echo> <help-echo> 
<help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> 
<help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> 
<help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <down> 
<down> <down> <down> <down> <down> <down> <down> C-c 
C-t d <up> <up> <up> <up> <up> <up> <up> <up> <up> 
C-x C-s C-x C-c <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> 
<help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> 
<help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <menu-bar> 
<help-menu> <send-emacs-bug-report>

Recent messages:
refile.org/ [3 times]
standards.org/HL7
ihe.org/ITI-admin
ihe.org/Tasks and Random stuff
Saving all Org-mode buffers...
Saving file /home/hornrj/org/JOURNAL.org...
Wrote /home/hornrj/org/JOURNAL.org
Saving all Org-mode buffers... done
(No files need saving)
When done with this frame, type C-x 5 0

Load-path shadows:
/home/hornrj/notmuch-0.13/emacs/notmuch-show hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-show
/home/hornrj/notmuch-0.13/emacs/notmuch-hello hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-hello
/home/hornrj/notmuch-0.13/emacs/notmuch-print hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-print
/home/hornrj/notmuch-0.13/emacs/notmuch hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch
/home/hornrj/notmuch-0.13/emacs/notmuch-query hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-query
/home/hornrj/notmuch-0.13/emacs/notmuch-message hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-message
/home/hornrj/notmuch-0.13/emacs/notmuch-maildir-fcc hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-maildir-fcc
/home/hornrj/notmuch-0.13/emacs/notmuch-address hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-address
/home/hornrj/notmuch-0.13/emacs/notmuch-mua hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-mua
/home/hornrj/notmuch-0.13/emacs/notmuch-tag hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-tag
/home/hornrj/notmuch-0.13/emacs/notmuch-lib hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-lib
/home/hornrj/notmuch-0.13/emacs/notmuch-crypto hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-crypto
/home/hornrj/notmuch-0.13/emacs/coolj hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/coolj
/home/hornrj/notmuch-0.13/emacs/notmuch-wash hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-wash
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-latex hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-latex
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-capture hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-capture
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-docbook hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-docbook
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-freemind hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-freemind
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-emacs-lisp hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-emacs-lisp
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-clojure hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-clojure
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-clock hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-clock
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-exp hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-exp
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-ruby hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-ruby
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-python hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-python
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-plot hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-plot
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-timer hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-timer
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-maxima hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-maxima
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-pcomplete hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-pcomplete
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-sqlite hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-sqlite
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-bbdb hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-bbdb
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-ref hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-ref
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-ocaml hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-ocaml
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-gnus hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-gnus
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-html hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-html
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-shen hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-shen
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-odt hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-odt
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-compat hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-compat
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-lilypond hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-lilypond
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-table hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-table
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-inlinetask hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-inlinetask
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-lisp hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-lisp
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-mks hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-mks
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-info hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-info
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-vm hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-vm
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-mscgen hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-mscgen
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-faces hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-faces
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-java hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-java
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-perl hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-perl
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-datetree hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-datetree
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-fortran hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-fortran
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-sass hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-sass
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-C hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-C
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-sql hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-sql
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-irc hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-irc
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-taskjuggler hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-taskjuggler
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-mouse hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-mouse
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-gnuplot hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-gnuplot
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-exp-blocks hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-exp-blocks
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-lob hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-lob
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-tangle hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-tangle
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-protocol hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-protocol
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-calc hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-calc
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-lparse hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-lparse
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-list hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-list
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-awk hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-awk
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-css hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-css
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-archive hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-archive
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-table hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-table
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-latex hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-latex
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-org hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-org
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-haskell hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-haskell
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-mac-message hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-mac-message
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-remember hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-remember
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-scheme hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-scheme
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-octave hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-octave
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-screen hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-screen
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-docview hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-docview
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-id hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-id
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-install hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-install
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-ledger hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-ledger
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-exp hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-exp
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-attach hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-attach
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-matlab hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-matlab
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-mew hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-mew
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-feed hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-feed
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-mhe hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-mhe
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-eshell hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-eshell
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-plantuml hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-plantuml
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-jsinfo hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-jsinfo
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-habit hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-habit
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-keys hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-keys
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-ditaa hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-ditaa
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-asymptote hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-asymptote
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-ctags hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-ctags
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-publish hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-publish
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-comint hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-comint
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-agenda hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-agenda
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-xoxo hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-xoxo
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-footnote hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-footnote
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-entities hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-entities
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-bibtex hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-bibtex
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-macs hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-macs
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-special-blocks hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-special-blocks
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-dot hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-dot
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-beamer hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-beamer
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-ascii hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-ascii
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-mobile hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-mobile
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-src hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-src
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-colview hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-colview
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-sh hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-sh
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-w3m hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-w3m
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-eval hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-eval
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-icalendar hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-icalendar
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-R hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-R
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-indent hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-indent
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-wl hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-wl
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-picolisp hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-picolisp
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-crypt hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-crypt
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/ob-js hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/ob-js
/home/hornrj/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120903/org-rmail hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.1/lisp/org/org-rmail

Features:
(shadow sort gnus-util mail-extr emacsbug sendmail cal-china lunar solar
cal-dst cal-bahai cal-islam cal-hebrew holidays hol-loaddefs cal-iso
vc-git org-w3m org-wl org-vm org-rmail org-mhe org-mew org-irc
org-inlinetask org-jsinfo org-infojs org-html org-exp ob-exp
org-exp-blocks org-info org-gnus org-docview org-bibtex bibtex org-bbdb
pp org-habit org-agenda org byte-opt warnings bytecomp byte-compile
cconv macroexp ob-tangle ob-lob ob-table org-footnote org-src ob-keys
org-pcomplete org-list org-faces org-entities noutline outline ob-sh
shell pcomplete ob-clojure ob-gnuplot ob-ruby ob-python ob-R ob-comint
comint ansi-color ob-ref ob-ditaa ob-dot ob-emacs-lisp ob org-compat
org-macs ob-eval find-func cus-edit time-date org-autoloads info package
tabulated-list tsdh-dark-theme delsel cus-start cus-load magit-bisect
magit-key-mode assoc magit server esh-var esh-io esh-cmd esh-ext
esh-proc esh-arg eldoc esh-groups eshell esh-module esh-mode esh-util
derived edmacro kmacro ediff-merg ediff-diff ediff-wind ediff-help
ediff-util ediff-mult ediff-init ediff ido iswitchb view log-edit ring
pcvs-util add-log cl notmuch hl-line notmuch-message notmuch-maildir-fcc
notmuch-hello wid-edit notmuch-show notmuch-print notmuch-crypto
notmuch-mua notmuch-address notmuch-wash advice help-fns advice-preload
diff-mode easy-mmode coolj notmuch-query json goto-addr thingatpt
icalendar diary-lib diary-loaddefs regexp-opt cal-menu calendar
cal-loaddefs notmuch-tag crm notmuch-lib message format-spec rfc822 mml
easymenu mailabbrev mail-utils gmm-utils mailheader mm-view mml-smime
mml-sec smime password-cache dig mm-decode mm-bodies mm-encode mailcap
mail-parse rfc2231 rfc2047 rfc2045 ietf-drums mm-util mail-prsvr tooltip
ediff-hook vc-hooks lisp-float-type mwheel x-win x-dnd tool-bar dnd
fontset image fringe lisp-mode register page menu-bar rfn-eshadow timer
select scroll-bar mouse jit-lock font-lock syntax facemenu font-core
frame cham georgian utf-8-lang misc-lang vietnamese tibetan thai
tai-viet lao korean japanese hebrew greek romanian slovak czech european
ethiopic indian cyrillic chinese case-table epa-hook jka-cmpr-hook help
simple abbrev minibuffer loaddefs button faces cus-face files
text-properties overlay sha1 md5 base64 format env code-pages mule
custom widget hashtable-print-readable backquote make-network-process
dbusbind dynamic-setting system-font-setting font-render-setting
move-toolbar gtk x-toolkit x multi-tty emacs)

bug#12467: 24.1; customization initialization confusing

[Glenn Morris]

Robert Horn wrote:

> I found a confusing behaviour for customization.  To trigger the
> behavior, assign a value of "t" to org-habit-show-all-today.  What I
> found is:
>
>  - If you start emacs and immediately go into *shell* and print org-habit-show-today-all you get an error because that variable has not yet been bound.

Customization only applies settings when relevant. Otherwise it would
have to unconditionally load at startup every package in which you have
customized an option. Use plain-old setq if you need different behaviour.

>   - If you start emacs and immediately go into options->config for
>   org-habit, the org-habit-show-today-all will indicate that it has
>   been set outside of the customization system when the customized
>   value is "t". When the customized value is "nil" there is no
>   indicated problem.

Sounds like a bug. However, there is no "org-habit-show-today-all"
variable in the Emacs trunk so I cannot test this. I cannot reproduce
this when customizing eg
org-export-html-table-use-header-tags-for-first-column.

> But a naive user would expect that starting the customization process
> for the group would also cause processing of the startup
> customization.

I don't really know what this means.

bug#12467: 24.1; customization initialization confusing

[Robert Horn]

Glenn Morris <rgm@gnu.org> writes:

> Robert Horn wrote:
>
>
>>   - If you start emacs and immediately go into options->config for
>>   org-habit, the org-habit-show-today-all will indicate that it has
>>   been set outside of the customization system when the customized
>>   value is "t". When the customized value is "nil" there is no
>>   indicated problem.
>
> Sounds like a bug. However, there is no "org-habit-show-today-all"
> variable in the Emacs trunk so I cannot test this. I cannot reproduce
> this when customizing eg
> org-export-html-table-use-header-tags-for-first-column.
>

Sorry, it's org-habit-show-all-today.

>> But a naive user would expect that starting the customization process
>> for the group would also cause processing of the startup
>> customization.
>
> I don't really know what this means.

As you say, customization only applies when relevant.  I would expect
that customizing would make it relevant, just like setting a buffer into
org-mode makes it relevant.  But the bug might be something else
entirely.

R Horn
rjhorn@alum.mit.edu

bug#12467: 24.1; customization initialization confusing

[Glenn Morris]

Robert Horn wrote:

>> Sounds like a bug. However, there is no "org-habit-show-today-all"
>> variable in the Emacs trunk so I cannot test this. I cannot reproduce
>> this when customizing eg
>> org-export-html-table-use-header-tags-for-first-column.
>>
>
> Sorry, it's org-habit-show-all-today.

I don't have that variable either.
I imagine any issue is related to the one you already reported

http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-orgmode/2012-09/msg00666.html

-(defvar org-habit-show-all-today nil)
+(defvar org-habit-show-all-today)

The original version is an obvious bug.

bug#12467: 24.1; customization initialization confusing

[Glenn Morris]

BTW, here is the relevant quote from the elisp manual (it's not really
relevant for the Emacs manual IMO):

 -- Function: custom-set-variables &rest args
     This function installs the variable customizations specified by
     ARGS.  Each argument in ARGS should have the form

          (VAR EXPRESSION [NOW [REQUEST [COMMENT]]])

     VAR is a variable name (a symbol), and EXPRESSION is an expression
     which evaluates to the desired customized value.

     If the `defcustom' form for VAR has been evaluated prior to this
     `custom-set-variables' call, EXPRESSION is immediately evaluated,
     and the variable's value is set to the result.  Otherwise,
     EXPRESSION is stored into the variable's `saved-value' property,
     to be evaluated when the relevant `defcustom' is called (usually
           ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
     when the library defining that variable is loaded into Emacs).
     ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

bug#12467: 24.1; customization initialization confusing

[Glenn Morris]

tags 12467 = notabug
stop

I'm closing this since I don't think there is any Emacs bug here.
Feel free to followup with more details if you disagree.