From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: "Juanma Barranquero" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: basic question: going back to dired Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2008 11:40:41 +0200 Message-ID: References: <4884DC7F.6060406@gmail.com> <87myk828zm.fsf@lion.rapttech.com.au> <873alz1no7.fsf@lion.rapttech.com.au> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1217497304 2603 80.91.229.12 (31 Jul 2008 09:41:44 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2008 09:41:44 +0000 (UTC) Cc: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org To: Bastien Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Thu Jul 31 11:42:34 2008 Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1KOUft-0005nf-EE for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Thu, 31 Jul 2008 11:42:21 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:44411 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1KOUey-0005Dc-Qh for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Thu, 31 Jul 2008 05:41:24 -0400 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1KOUeK-0005CZ-Sm for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 31 Jul 2008 05:40:44 -0400 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1KOUeI-0005BT-HK for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 31 Jul 2008 05:40:42 -0400 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=41422 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1KOUeI-0005BN-DH for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 31 Jul 2008 05:40:42 -0400 Original-Received: from nf-out-0910.google.com ([64.233.182.188]:30478) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1KOUeI-0005Ol-2l for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 31 Jul 2008 05:40:42 -0400 Original-Received: by nf-out-0910.google.com with SMTP id c7so181987nfi.26 for ; Thu, 31 Jul 2008 02:40:41 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:to :subject:cc:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type :content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; bh=gZeIHniOJIh+TGTRhqEQFFbNcyezDb07FBrfGJSRVXQ=; b=a2p8mq859cgrvfk7tPR4GNiYCvlYkry3pyd226HPkjExpKucYqqPHW/YNSrhX6B7on EVCkM33ULRWb4VedUzwC04xvV4GDNmu9kWypR71vHYDpdie1iMvLwqUsKEBoW+th3GoW mryXmeb+59t4mzjZ163aIoE9rTT+H6HgXCBfg= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=message-id:date:from:to:subject:cc:in-reply-to:mime-version :content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition :references; b=w7Wpd1StgQquHDRrduxKT/WtMP4YGuGTn+YtwDaQsOrEDl3VUQwAm9Gc3fcWyc2Cw2 pYBfoMBZxgn8f0pHRvjjnPJalSnNaBoUyXb/hlBd+Ez5ouieTEk69oqi43mAE0e6JiGZ DEOwpqOs2JT0Uxvqjem1sdUJNwJbGrasqY56A= Original-Received: by 10.210.56.7 with SMTP id e7mr6513657eba.1.1217497241223; Thu, 31 Jul 2008 02:40:41 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: by 10.210.71.14 with HTTP; Thu, 31 Jul 2008 02:40:41 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: Content-Disposition: inline X-detected-kernel: by monty-python.gnu.org: Linux 2.6 (newer, 2) X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.help:56077 Archived-At: On Sat, Jul 26, 2008 at 13:06, Bastien wrote: > Is it really because it's too far removed from what they're used to? > Or is this just an excuse for not trying to move? It is always difficult to separate these, but certainly unfamiliarity is a big factor in this specific case. > If they could be convinced that the cost of investing in learning Emacs > would finally be rewarding (and save them *lots* of pain), then I guess > they'd learn Emacs. Whenever I've tried to make them upgrade something it's been a hard, uphill battle. Some of them are still using very old computers, with Windows 95 and obsolete hardware (no USB, coaxial cabling, etc.). They insist that "it works" and the disruption of upgrading is not worth the cost. As I'm the first one they call when they have trouble, I can assure you it *does not* work (unless continuous problems and an entirely unreliable network are considered as "working") and that it would be quite worthwhile. Juanma