From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Drew Adams Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: RE: char equivalence classes in search - why not symmetric? Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2015 09:33:42 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: References: <2a7b9134-af2a-462d-af6c-d02bad60bbe8@default> <834mjecdy7.fsf@gnu.org> <38061f42-eaf1-47c6-b74d-f676ac952b18@default> <83r3miatvl.fsf@gnu.org> <21998.29683.916211.867479@a1i15.kph.uni-mainz.de> <9A972800-D8F0-4DA8-877E-07D5BDC2E1F9@gmail.com> <87oahd11i9.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <8cf269bc-69d8-4752-8506-de8d992512e1@default> <4f3b1db3-d3d2-480f-8662-fbf7c74aa67f@default> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1441989256 3265 80.91.229.3 (11 Sep 2015 16:34:16 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2015 16:34:16 +0000 (UTC) Cc: stephen@xemacs.org, jean.christophe.helary@gmail.com, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Stefan Monnier , Richard Stallman Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Fri Sep 11 18:34:03 2015 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1ZaRGy-0007fe-KD for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 11 Sep 2015 18:34:00 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:57417 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZaRGy-00052m-0R for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 11 Sep 2015 12:34:00 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:40089) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZaRGu-00052Y-Mo for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 11 Sep 2015 12:33:57 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZaRGq-0001HN-Ku for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 11 Sep 2015 12:33:56 -0400 Original-Received: from aserp1040.oracle.com ([141.146.126.69]:41320) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZaRGq-0001HG-F5; Fri, 11 Sep 2015 12:33:52 -0400 Original-Received: from aserv0022.oracle.com (aserv0022.oracle.com [141.146.126.234]) by aserp1040.oracle.com (Sentrion-MTA-4.3.2/Sentrion-MTA-4.3.2) with ESMTP id t8BGXmNk025609 (version=TLSv1 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 11 Sep 2015 16:33:48 GMT Original-Received: from userv0121.oracle.com (userv0121.oracle.com [156.151.31.72]) by aserv0022.oracle.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id t8BGXlFK003489 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 11 Sep 2015 16:33:48 GMT Original-Received: from abhmp0010.oracle.com (abhmp0010.oracle.com [141.146.116.16]) by userv0121.oracle.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id t8BGXj39006713; Fri, 11 Sep 2015 16:33:46 GMT In-Reply-To: X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Oracle Beehive Extensions for Outlook 2.0.1.9 (901082) [OL 12.0.6691.5000 (x86)] X-Source-IP: aserv0022.oracle.com [141.146.126.234] X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.4.x-2.6.x [generic] X-Received-From: 141.146.126.69 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:189841 Archived-At: > > current situation with case folding, that you can't paste in > > a search string with capital letters and search for it in a > > case-independent way. >=20 > Yes, you can: Use M-c to explicitly choose whether to case-fold or not. Your "Yes" is really an agreement that no, you cannot, but you can at least override/cancel Emacs's DWIM behavior, by then using `M-c' to explicitly turn case-folding back on. That is, after you figure out that Emacs has turned the tables on you (and there is no signal that it has - no message telling you that it is now searching case-sensitively), you can insist that it go back to the mode you had already chosen: case-insensitive. And thank goodness Emacs does not remove this possibility of overriding its second-guessing. > > However, in the case of case folding, we solve that by downcasing > > text when pasting it into search strings. We could de-accent > > strings too when pasting them. >=20 > Actually, the way we downcase it has problems. E.g. Go to the > beginning of this paragraph (i.e. before "Actually") and do: > C-s C-w M-c and you end up searching for an exact (non-case-folded) > match of "actually" rather than "Actually", so it won't even match the > "Actually" from which you got it. Yes. And see my reply to RMS - if you paste text with an uppercase letter while editing the search string using `M-e', case-folding is still turned off automatically. IOW, the automatic downcasing DWIM is used only when you use `C-M-y' (or `C-w') to yank some text at point into the search string. What was said about automatic downcasing is not true for pasting in general. Which points to another possibility of use confusion (inconsistency).