From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Lennart Borgman Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#2473: usability issues on emacs's describe-mode Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2009 00:56:55 +0100 Message-ID: References: Reply-To: Lennart Borgman , 2473@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1235779496 14061 80.91.229.12 (28 Feb 2009 00:04:56 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2009 00:04:56 +0000 (UTC) Cc: xah@xahlee.org To: rms@gnu.org, 2473@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat Feb 28 01:06:10 2009 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1LdChZ-0005HG-Nf for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sat, 28 Feb 2009 01:05:25 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:39902 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1LdCgE-0000Zj-Rt for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Fri, 27 Feb 2009 19:03:46 -0500 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1LdCgA-0000YR-PO for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 27 Feb 2009 19:03:42 -0500 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1LdCg9-0000WY-8i for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 27 Feb 2009 19:03:42 -0500 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=41865 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1LdCg8-0000WJ-Un for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 27 Feb 2009 19:03:41 -0500 Original-Received: from rzlab.ucr.edu ([138.23.92.77]:60751) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS-1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1LdCg8-00018P-5N for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 27 Feb 2009 19:03:40 -0500 Original-Received: from rzlab.ucr.edu (rzlab.ucr.edu [127.0.0.1]) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.13.8/8.13.8/Debian-3) with ESMTP id n1S03cqH021154; Fri, 27 Feb 2009 16:03:38 -0800 Original-Received: (from debbugs@localhost) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.13.8/8.13.8/Submit) id n1S0071d019863; Fri, 27 Feb 2009 16:00:07 -0800 X-Loop: owner@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com Resent-From: Lennart Borgman Resent-To: bug-submit-list@donarmstrong.com Resent-CC: Emacs Bugs Resent-Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2009 00:00:06 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: owner@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com X-Emacs-PR-Message: followup 2473 X-Emacs-PR-Package: emacs X-Emacs-PR-Keywords: Original-Received: via spool by 2473-submit@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com id=B2473.123577902419283 (code B ref 2473); Sat, 28 Feb 2009 00:00:06 +0000 Original-Received: (at 2473) by emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com; 27 Feb 2009 23:57:04 +0000 X-Spam-Bayes: score:0.5 Bayes not run. spammytokens:Tokens not available. hammytokens:Tokens not available. Original-Received: from mail-gx0-f177.google.com (mail-gx0-f177.google.com [209.85.217.177]) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.13.8/8.13.8/Debian-3) with ESMTP id n1RNv1uC019260 for <2473@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com>; Fri, 27 Feb 2009 15:57:02 -0800 Original-Received: by gxk25 with SMTP id 25so3430833gxk.1 for <2473@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com>; Fri, 27 Feb 2009 15:56:55 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:received:in-reply-to:references :date:message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=fdjo8Fhe4f6NHTbZrk0DQ9Fo79HLqki7i1SfbWU9frM=; b=fO52XPqm006nf5l1oPBh9Ua3/sg4hMmhoStwLiQuvWwD5ciHOmFYaBFHWEa+6dIg5N pnVjJuWvvNFjdI3P32F72T2EHVv/c3Xy1t1arYIJIOOLSyrdJwHCTtgy6VJWlQQjL3/t Ywr2nbiMtEiClLq2ILrNeacaV+CMPLj+qWL+g= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=f4SruqtsH/xER6c8f4+1kuTqFLKr3xBFhyPcmoUTjvy9rodGzs+6nEF9IuVPU75Asd AJBh+Wi0VaoqoMfIvCCfrFkCUSLBp4dnsVqXAG2VMN1HOPJAsnCMr9U7n27ky3BYBKDS 4uOENZ69MQlZHNwNyBt9+QhZhMIxplqpvKEQ8= Original-Received: by 10.231.20.1 with SMTP id d1mr2553249ibb.19.1235779015438; Fri, 27 Feb 2009 15:56:55 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: X-detected-operating-system: by monty-python.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 3) Resent-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2009 19:03:42 -0500 X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.bugs:25817 Archived-At: On Sat, Feb 28, 2009 at 12:33 AM, Richard M Stallman wrote: > =C2=A0 =C2=A0I see a 3rd way: make the buffer present an expandable list = of modes, > =C2=A0 =C2=A0starting with just 2 items: the current major modes and "min= or modes", > =C2=A0 =C2=A0e.g. similar to what we do in Speedbar, or maybe in Outline = Mode > =C2=A0 =C2=A0(under "Hide Sublevels"). =C2=A0In ASCII art: > > =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0+ Major Mode: RMAIL Mode > =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0+ Minor Modes > > Using hiding is a good idea -- thanks. > > I think that partcular way would be inconvenient. =C2=A0Specifically, it > would be a hassle to initially hide the major mode documentation. > That is what users most often want to see; making them type a command > to expose it would be a gratuitous hassle. > > So I suggest putting the partly-hidden minor mode list first, > followed by the totally visible major mode documentation. Maybe, but then make the major mode "node" hideable too.