buffer management in emacs

buffer management in emacs

[.Martin.]

Hi all,
1. Is there any way of temporarily bookimaring buffers so that I can switch
between them more efficiently? Gnus itself has a good few buffers (of
which I only use the main one where groups are listed), then
when I open a few messages the buffers usually stay. I usually switch
between buffers by C-x and right/left arrows. I bet there's a much
better way of doing it.
I know of C-x b, but then I have to press TAB to list buffers and do
autocompletion. How do you switch between buffers?

thank you

-- 
regards

.Martin.

Re: buffer management in emacs

[Claudius Hubig]

xtd8865@gmail.com (.Martin.) wrote:
>Hi all,
>1. Is there any way of temporarily bookimaring buffers so that I can switch
>between them more efficiently? Gnus itself has a good few buffers (of
>which I only use the main one where groups are listed), then
>when I open a few messages the buffers usually stay. I usually switch
>between buffers by C-x and right/left arrows. I bet there's a much
>better way of doing it.
>I know of C-x b, but then I have to press TAB to list buffers and do
>autocompletion. How do you switch between buffers?

I'm sorry to be unable to provide you with a better option, just an idea:

Would it be "somehow" possible to bind Alt+{1,…,9} to switch to the
first, second, third buffer?

C-x C-b shows that the buffers do have numbers and using Alt+:num: to
switch tabs within other applications is often used.

Best regards,

Claudius
-- 
No one gets sick on Wednesdays.

http://chubig.net/

Re: buffer management in emacs

[.Martin.]

Claudius Hubig <claudiushubig@arcor.de> writes:

> xtd8865@gmail.com (.Martin.) wrote:
>>Hi all,
>>1. Is there any way of temporarily bookimaring buffers so that I can switch
>>between them more efficiently? Gnus itself has a good few buffers (of
>>which I only use the main one where groups are listed), then
>>when I open a few messages the buffers usually stay. I usually switch
>>between buffers by C-x and right/left arrows. I bet there's a much
>>better way of doing it.
>>I know of C-x b, but then I have to press TAB to list buffers and do
>>autocompletion. How do you switch between buffers?
>
> I'm sorry to be unable to provide you with a better option, just an idea:
>
> Would it be "somehow" possible to bind Alt+{1,…,9} to switch to the
> first, second, third buffer?
>
> C-x C-b shows that the buffers do have numbers and using Alt+:num: to
> switch tabs within other applications is often used.
>
> Best regards,
>
> Claudius

Thanks for your reply. Alt+1,2, etc is already used by an XFCE terminal
emulator which I'm using (The windows key could do it - I'm not sure how
i'd bind it, though)

Does it mean that nobody alse has problems with it? I mean either I'm
misusing something unnecesarily ending up with 10-20 buffers (gnus,
slime, notes) or it's normal, however, not really annoying for most
emacs users:)


What say you?:)


-- 
regards

.Martin.

Re: buffer management in emacs

[Stefan Monnier]

> Does it mean that nobody alse has problems with it? I mean either I'm
> misusing something unnecesarily ending up with 10-20 buffers (gnus,
> slime, notes) or it's normal, however, not really annoying for most
> emacs users:)

There are many different packages/commands to switch buffer.
Most likely, the C-x b way is the most common, and you can speed it up
with iswitchb or ido if you like it.


        Stefan

Re: buffer management in emacs

[Chris F.A. Johnson]

On 2010-04-18, .Martin. wrote:
> Hi all,
> 1. Is there any way of temporarily bookimaring buffers so that I can switch
> between them more efficiently? Gnus itself has a good few buffers (of
> which I only use the main one where groups are listed), then
> when I open a few messages the buffers usually stay. I usually switch
> between buffers by C-x and right/left arrows. I bet there's a much
> better way of doing it.
> I know of C-x b, but then I have to press TAB to list buffers and do
> autocompletion. How do you switch between buffers?

   I bind a key (print) to electric-buffer-list.

-- 
   Chris F.A. Johnson                          <http://cfajohnson.com>
   Author:                                     =======================
   Pro Bash Programming: Scripting the GNU/Linux Shell (2009, Apress)
   Shell Scripting Recipes: A Problem-Solution Approach (2005, Apress)

Re: buffer management in emacs

[despen]

"Chris F.A. Johnson" <cfajohnson@gmail.com> writes:

> On 2010-04-18, .Martin. wrote:
>> Hi all,
>> 1. Is there any way of temporarily bookimaring buffers so that I can switch
>> between them more efficiently? Gnus itself has a good few buffers (of
>> which I only use the main one where groups are listed), then
>> when I open a few messages the buffers usually stay. I usually switch
>> between buffers by C-x and right/left arrows. I bet there's a much
>> better way of doing it.
>> I know of C-x b, but then I have to press TAB to list buffers and do
>> autocompletion. How do you switch between buffers?
>
>    I bind a key (print) to electric-buffer-list.

Agree completely, best way I know of to switch buffers.

Except that the key to use is F9.  :)

Re: buffer management in emacs

[Kevin Rodgers]

despen@verizon.net wrote:
> "Chris F.A. Johnson" <cfajohnson@gmail.com> writes:
> 
>> On 2010-04-18, .Martin. wrote:
>>> Hi all,
>>> 1. Is there any way of temporarily bookimaring buffers so that I can switch
>>> between them more efficiently? Gnus itself has a good few buffers (of
>>> which I only use the main one where groups are listed), then
>>> when I open a few messages the buffers usually stay. I usually switch
>>> between buffers by C-x and right/left arrows. I bet there's a much
>>> better way of doing it.
>>> I know of C-x b, but then I have to press TAB to list buffers and do
>>> autocompletion. How do you switch between buffers?
>>    I bind a key (print) to electric-buffer-list.
> 
> Agree completely, best way I know of to switch buffers.
> 
> Except that the key to use is F9.  :)

Nah:

(global-set-key "\C-x\C-b" 'electric-buffer-list) ; was list-buffers

-- 
Kevin Rodgers
Denver, Colorado, USA

Re: buffer management in emacs

[despen]

Kevin Rodgers <kevin.d.rodgers@gmail.com> writes:

> despen@verizon.net wrote:
>> "Chris F.A. Johnson" <cfajohnson@gmail.com> writes:
>>
>>> On 2010-04-18, .Martin. wrote:
>>>> Hi all,
>>>> 1. Is there any way of temporarily bookimaring buffers so that I can switch
>>>> between them more efficiently? Gnus itself has a good few buffers (of
>>>> which I only use the main one where groups are listed), then
>>>> when I open a few messages the buffers usually stay. I usually switch
>>>> between buffers by C-x and right/left arrows. I bet there's a much
>>>> better way of doing it.
>>>> I know of C-x b, but then I have to press TAB to list buffers and do
>>>> autocompletion. How do you switch between buffers?
>>>    I bind a key (print) to electric-buffer-list.
>>
>> Agree completely, best way I know of to switch buffers.
>>
>> Except that the key to use is F9.  :)
>
> Nah:
>
> (global-set-key "\C-x\C-b" 'electric-buffer-list) ; was list-buffers

I have that too, but one key is always better than 2.

Re: buffer management in emacs

[Kevin Rodgers]

despen@verizon.net wrote:
> Kevin Rodgers <kevin.d.rodgers@gmail.com> writes:
> 
>> despen@verizon.net wrote:
>>> "Chris F.A. Johnson" <cfajohnson@gmail.com> writes:
>>>
>>>> On 2010-04-18, .Martin. wrote:
>>>>> Hi all,
>>>>> 1. Is there any way of temporarily bookimaring buffers so that I can switch
>>>>> between them more efficiently? Gnus itself has a good few buffers (of
>>>>> which I only use the main one where groups are listed), then
>>>>> when I open a few messages the buffers usually stay. I usually switch
>>>>> between buffers by C-x and right/left arrows. I bet there's a much
>>>>> better way of doing it.
>>>>> I know of C-x b, but then I have to press TAB to list buffers and do
>>>>> autocompletion. How do you switch between buffers?
>>>>    I bind a key (print) to electric-buffer-list.
>>> Agree completely, best way I know of to switch buffers.
>>>
>>> Except that the key to use is F9.  :)
>> Nah:
>>
>> (global-set-key "\C-x\C-b" 'electric-buffer-list) ; was list-buffers
> 
> I have that too, but one key is always better than 2.

Not if you have to move your hands from the home row and look at the
keyboard to type it (IMHO).

-- 
Kevin Rodgers
Denver, Colorado, USA

Re: buffer management in emacs

[despen]

Kevin Rodgers <kevin.d.rodgers@gmail.com> writes:

> despen@verizon.net wrote:
>> Kevin Rodgers <kevin.d.rodgers@gmail.com> writes:
>>
>>> despen@verizon.net wrote:
>>>> "Chris F.A. Johnson" <cfajohnson@gmail.com> writes:
>>>>
>>>>> On 2010-04-18, .Martin. wrote:
>>>>>> Hi all,
>>>>>> 1. Is there any way of temporarily bookimaring buffers so that I can switch
>>>>>> between them more efficiently? Gnus itself has a good few buffers (of
>>>>>> which I only use the main one where groups are listed), then
>>>>>> when I open a few messages the buffers usually stay. I usually switch
>>>>>> between buffers by C-x and right/left arrows. I bet there's a much
>>>>>> better way of doing it.
>>>>>> I know of C-x b, but then I have to press TAB to list buffers and do
>>>>>> autocompletion. How do you switch between buffers?
>>>>>    I bind a key (print) to electric-buffer-list.
>>>> Agree completely, best way I know of to switch buffers.
>>>>
>>>> Except that the key to use is F9.  :)
>>> Nah:
>>>
>>> (global-set-key "\C-x\C-b" 'electric-buffer-list) ; was list-buffers
>>
>> I have that too, but one key is always better than 2.
>
> Not if you have to move your hands from the home row and look at the
> keyboard to type it (IMHO).

Control isn't on the home row.

Even using the left pinky on the control key,
the x and b keys aren't that easy to reach.

OTOH, F9 is usually pretty easy to find, without looking,
especially with the gap between the F8 and F9 keys.

Using the buffer list isn't really a full speed typing thing either,
at least not for me.

I can't just leave F9 sitting there doing nothing in Emacs.

Re: buffer management in emacs

[Sean Sieger]

despen@verizon.net writes:

    > Not if you have to move your hands from the home row and look at the
    > keyboard to type it (IMHO).

    Control isn't on the home row.

    Even using the left pinky on the control key,
    the x and b keys aren't that easy to reach.

As with the use of <Shift> in touch typing, one uses the `opposite' hand
to type the modifier:  Right hand little finger types <Ctrl>, the left
hand ring finger, `x' and index finger, `b'.  And in fact, I think I
remember being taught not to `hold' modifier keys, but type them with
each character to be modified.

Not the contortion you describe above; and as Kevin pointed out, never
leave the home row.

Want to type great?  Install Gtypist and use it as if it were a video
game.  You'll learn to paint the screen with characters, words and
sentences.

    OTOH, F9 is usually pretty easy to find, without looking,
    especially with the gap between the F8 and F9 keys.

    Using the buffer list isn't really a full speed typing thing either,
    at least not for me.

It will be when you touch type.

    I can't just leave F9 sitting there doing nothing in Emacs.

Re: buffer management in emacs

[despen]

Sean Sieger <sean.sieger@gmail.com> writes:

> despen@verizon.net writes:
>
>     > Not if you have to move your hands from the home row and look at the
>     > keyboard to type it (IMHO).
>
>     Control isn't on the home row.
>
>     Even using the left pinky on the control key,
>     the x and b keys aren't that easy to reach.
>
> As with the use of <Shift> in touch typing, one uses the `opposite' hand
> to type the modifier:  Right hand little finger types <Ctrl>, the left
> hand ring finger, `x' and index finger, `b'.  And in fact, I think I
> remember being taught not to `hold' modifier keys, but type them with
> each character to be modified.

Yep, sorry.  Meant to say right pinky.

As far as holding the modifier keys, for ^x^b it works when I hold
down control (right control) and I certainly wouldn't want to add
another 2 movements to the process.

Re: buffer management in emacs

[Sean Sieger]

despen@verizon.net writes:

    As far as holding the modifier keys, for ^x^b it works when I hold
    down control (right control) and I certainly wouldn't want to add
    another 2 movements to the process.

Uh-huh, it's resistance to the ``... two movements ...'' that slows us
down in the long run.

Re: buffer management in emacs

[Stefan Monnier]

> Control isn't on the home row.

Heresy!


        Stefan "Of course it is, as god intended!  Death to caps-lock!"

Re: buffer management in emacs

[despen]

Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> writes:

>> Control isn't on the home row.
>
> Heresy!

Well, for true believers, left control is right there next to
the "a" key (where it belongs), but I tend to think of the home
row as where my 8 finger tips rest.

Re: buffer management in emacs

[Stefan Kamphausen]

Hi,

xtd8865@gmail.com (.Martin.) writes:

> Hi all,
> 1. Is there any way of temporarily bookimaring buffers so that I can switch
> between them more efficiently?

may I humbly point you to MTorus?  There are two implementations of it,
the older of which is mine and is what I use.

http://www.skamphausen.de/cgi-bin/ska/mtorus
http://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/MTorus


Cheers,
Stefan
-- 
a blessed +42 regexp of confusion (weapon in hand)
You hit. The format string crumbles and turns to dust.
user=> (clojure-buch (Locale/GERMANY))
#<URL http://www.clojure-buch.de>

Re: buffer management in emacs

[Xah Lee]

On Apr 18, 2:17 pm, xtd8...@gmail.com (.Martin.) wrote:
> Hi all,
> 1. Is there any way of temporarily bookimaring buffers so that I can switch
> between them more efficiently? Gnus itself has a good few buffers (of
> which I only use the main one where groups are listed), then
> when I open a few messages the buffers usually stay. I usually switch
> between buffers by C-x and right/left arrows. I bet there's a much
> better way of doing it.
> I know of C-x b, but then I have to press TAB to list buffers and do
> autocompletion. How do you switch between buffers?

there are several buffer switching packages, many comes with emacs 22
and 23.

Personally, i use ibuffer. Just type Alt+x ibuffer. You should also
replace the default keybinding.

there's also iswitch, and ido, among others.

they all help you manage buffers.

The emacs buffer management problem really has to do with emacs's lack
of closing file command. There's kill-file, but it requires you to
confirm, even a saved file. Plus, there's no keyboard shortcut for it.
So, this tends to get people to leave behind lots of opened files.

Usually hundreds of buffers that are accumulated in weeks or months
are reported by long time emacs users.

for me, i prefer to close a file or buffer whenever i'm done with it.
So, my open buffers represent things i am working on, or need to work
on. Typically they are no more than 10 open files. I've also
customized my emacs extensively, so that i have single shortcut to
close buffer (or create new one), and without asking me if the buffer
is already saved, and can open accidentally closed buffer (similar to
accidentally closed tabs in browsers). Also, for switching to next/
previous buffer, i have easy shortcuts the same as switching tabs in
browsers.

If you are interested in this UI, you can try it or get the code at
ergoemacs.org

some of these ideas are written here:

  http://xahlee.org/emacs/modernization_scratch_buffer.html
  http://xahlee.org/emacs/effective_emacs.html

  Xah
∑ http://xahlee.org/

☄

Re: buffer management in emacs

[Tyler Smith]

Xah Lee <xahlee@gmail.com> writes:

> The emacs buffer management problem really has to do with emacs's lack
> of closing file command. There's kill-file, but it requires you to
> confirm, even a saved file. Plus, there's no keyboard shortcut for it.
> So, this tends to get people to leave behind lots of opened files.

Isn't 'C-x k' (kill-buffer) basically a file closing command? It doesn't
require confirmation for files that are already saved, and the file that
the buffer was visiting is then removed from the buffer list. Or am I
misunderstanding what you mean by 'close file'.

Also, I can't find kill-file on my emacs (GNU Emacs 24.0.50.2), did you
mean kill-buffer to begin with?

Tyler

Re: buffer management in emacs

[B. T. Raven]

Xah Lee wrote:
> On Apr 18, 2:17 pm, xtd8...@gmail.com (.Martin.) wrote:
>> Hi all,
>> 1. Is there any way of temporarily bookimaring buffers so that I can switch
>> between them more efficiently? Gnus itself has a good few buffers (of
>> which I only use the main one where groups are listed), then
>> when I open a few messages the buffers usually stay. I usually switch
>> between buffers by C-x and right/left arrows. I bet there's a much
>> better way of doing it.
>> I know of C-x b, but then I have to press TAB to list buffers and do
>> autocompletion. How do you switch between buffers?
> 
> there are several buffer switching packages, many comes with emacs 22
> and 23.
> 
> Personally, i use ibuffer. Just type Alt+x ibuffer. You should also
> replace the default keybinding.
> 
> there's also iswitch, and ido, among others.
> 
> they all help you manage buffers.
> 
> The emacs buffer management problem really has to do with emacs's lack
> of closing file command. There's kill-file, but it requires you to
> confirm, even a saved file. Plus, there's no keyboard shortcut for it.
> So, this tends to get people to leave behind lots of opened files.

C-x k is kill-buffer. If buffer is unchanged or saved, no confirmation
is necessary. In general, when a file is loaded into a buffer it is not
left open, so in w32 at least there is no sharing violation if you
manipulate it outside of Emacs.

> 
> Usually hundreds of buffers that are accumulated in weeks or months
> are reported by long time emacs users.
> 
> for me, i prefer to close a file or buffer whenever i'm done with it.
> So, my open buffers represent things i am working on, or need to work
> on. Typically they are no more than 10 open files. I've also
> customized my emacs extensively, so that i have single shortcut to
> close buffer (or create new one), and without asking me if the buffer
> is already saved, and can open accidentally closed buffer (similar to
> accidentally closed tabs in browsers). Also, for switching to next/
> previous buffer, i have easy shortcuts the same as switching tabs in
> browsers.

Electric-buffer-list and ibuffer-other-window let you kill multiple
buffers in much the same way you can delete files in dired.

> 
> If you are interested in this UI, you can try it or get the code at
> ergoemacs.org
> 
> some of these ideas are written here:
> 
>   http://xahlee.org/emacs/modernization_scratch_buffer.html
>   http://xahlee.org/emacs/effective_emacs.html
> 
>   Xah
> ∑ http://xahlee.org/
> 
> ☄

Re: buffer management in emacs

[Xah Lee]

On May 5, 6:51 am, Tyler Smith <tyler.sm...@eku.edu> wrote:
> Xah Lee <xah...@gmail.com> writes:
> > The emacs buffer management problem really has to do with emacs's lack
> > of closing file command. There's kill-file, but it requires you to
> > confirm, even a saved file. Plus, there's no keyboard shortcut for it.
> > So, this tends to get people to leave behind lots of opened files.
>
> Isn't 'C-x k' (kill-buffer) basically a file closing command? It doesn't
> require confirmation for files that are already saved, and the file that
> the buffer was visiting is then removed from the buffer list. Or am I
> misunderstanding what you mean by 'close file'.
>
> Also, I can't find kill-file on my emacs (GNU Emacs 24.0.50.2), did you
> mean kill-buffer to begin with?
>
> Tyler

sorry, been sloppy.

yes i meant kill-buffer (shortcut C-x k)

when you call kill-buffer, it prompts you, even for a saved file. More
specifically, it prompts you which buffer you want to kill. It does
not simply close the current buffer.

the other problem is that when you kill a buffer not asociated with a
file, even if it is not saved, has content, it'll simply kill it after
you give the buffer name, but not prompting you whether to save it.

the link i gave in my previous post does give detail about these.

  Xah
∑ http://xahlee.org/

☄

Re: buffer management in emacs

[Xah Lee]

PS in a earlier post in this thread, i mentioned no keyboard shortcut.
That refers to the Close command in the menu, which calles kill-this-
buffer.

 Xah

Re: buffer management in emacs

[Lennart Borgman]

On Thu, May 6, 2010 at 11:52 AM, Xah Lee <xahlee@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> when you call kill-buffer, it prompts you, even for a saved file. More
> specifically, it prompts you which buffer you want to kill. It does
> not simply close the current buffer.

Since current buffer is the default it means you have to do

   C-x k RET

to kill the current buffer.

Re: buffer management in emacs

[Tyler Smith]

Xah Lee <xahlee@gmail.com> writes:

> On May 5, 6:51 am, Tyler Smith <tyler.sm...@eku.edu> wrote:
>> Xah Lee <xah...@gmail.com> writes:
>> > The emacs buffer management problem really has to do with emacs's lack
>> > of closing file command. There's kill-file, but it requires you to
>> > confirm, even a saved file. Plus, there's no keyboard shortcut for it.
>> > So, this tends to get people to leave behind lots of opened files.
>>
>> Isn't 'C-x k' (kill-buffer) basically a file closing command? It doesn't
>> require confirmation for files that are already saved, and the file that
>> the buffer was visiting is then removed from the buffer list. Or am I
>> misunderstanding what you mean by 'close file'.
>>
>> Also, I can't find kill-file on my emacs (GNU Emacs 24.0.50.2), did you
>> mean kill-buffer to begin with?
>>
>> Tyler
>
> sorry, been sloppy.
>
> yes i meant kill-buffer (shortcut C-x k)
>
> when you call kill-buffer, it prompts you, even for a saved file. More
> specifically, it prompts you which buffer you want to kill. It does
> not simply close the current buffer.

Ah! I understand now. It does actually ask for confirmation of which
buffer you want to kill, but if you just hit return, the default is to
close the current buffer. So the sequence 'C-x k <return>' will kill the
current buffer. I don't even notice that I'm pressing <return> anymore,
since I never use this function to kill buffers other than the current
one.

Cheers,

Tyler

RE: buffer management in emacs

[Drew Adams]

> How do you switch between buffers?

The question has been asked before: ;-)

http://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/CategoryBufferSwitching