* cvs emacs scales fonts to awfully big? @ 2008-12-27 23:18 Peter Tury 2008-12-28 0:38 ` Peter Dyballa [not found] ` <mailman.3422.1230424737.26697.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org> 0 siblings, 2 replies; 7+ messages in thread From: Peter Tury @ 2008-12-27 23:18 UTC (permalink / raw) To: help-gnu-emacs Hi, I built cvs emacs on ubuntu 8.10. Now I have GNU Emacs 23.0.60.1 (i686-pc-linux-gnu, GTK+ Version 2.14.4) of 2008-12-27 on tury-8-usb Windowing system distributor `The X.Org Foundation', version 11.0.10502000 Important settings: value of $LC_ALL: nil value of $LC_COLLATE: nil value of $LC_CTYPE: nil value of $LC_MESSAGES: nil value of $LC_MONETARY: nil value of $LC_NUMERIC: nil value of $LC_TIME: nil value of $LANG: hu_HU.UTF-8 value of $XMODIFIERS: nil locale-coding-system: utf-8-unix default-enable-multibyte-characters: t The problem is that Emacs uses too big fonts by default. More exactly I think it scales somehow the fonts, though it shouldn't. Menus are OK, but buffer text and tooltips and mode line come with huge fonts. I uploaded an image about the problem: here you can see that menus are OK, but everything else is awfully huge. A Gedit and a terminal window is captured also to show the differences better: http://img266.imageshack.us/img266/2383/emacsfontscale2bd9.jpg I think maybe the "22" in "Font: #<font-object -unknown-DejaVu Sans Mono-normal-normal-normal-*-22-*-*-*-m-0-iso10646-1>" is the key (see the image above); but where does it come from? I neither have .emacs nor .Xdefaults when I reproduced the error for the image. I have this problem with older cvs versions as well (at least for a few months). Did I do something wrong at compilation of Emacs? Does something missing from my Ubuntu? What to check? Maybe I have the same problem as frecon here: http://ubuntuforums.org/archive/index.php/t-803119.html? (I can use Emacs with setting 8pt font size in .Xdefaults or using text-scale-adjust, but I want Emacs behave correctly by default.) Thanks, P ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 7+ messages in thread
* Re: cvs emacs scales fonts to awfully big? 2008-12-27 23:18 cvs emacs scales fonts to awfully big? Peter Tury @ 2008-12-28 0:38 ` Peter Dyballa [not found] ` <mailman.3422.1230424737.26697.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org> 1 sibling, 0 replies; 7+ messages in thread From: Peter Dyballa @ 2008-12-28 0:38 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Peter Tury; +Cc: help-gnu-emacs Am 28.12.2008 um 00:18 schrieb Peter Tury: > Did I do something wrong at compilation of Emacs? Does something > missing from my Ubuntu? What to check? In KDE and GNOME there are rule settings about appropriate font sizes. An optimised bitmapped font for 100 DPI is larger than the same font for 75 DPI. When the X11 font path has the 100 DPI font before the 75 DPI fonts than these larger fonts are used. GNU Emacs 23.0.60 uses libXft. When a 100 DPI display is assumed by Xft then quite large 75 DPI fonts might be used ... You could add to your X defaults a setting like this: Xft.dpi: 96 or a value closer to your display's resolution. It might also help to run your X server with your display's resolution. Some X servers evaluate the contents of a ~/.xserverrc file. -- Greetings Pete Who the fsck is "General Failure," and why is he reading my disk? ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 7+ messages in thread
[parent not found: <mailman.3422.1230424737.26697.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>]
* Re: cvs emacs scales fonts to awfully big? [not found] ` <mailman.3422.1230424737.26697.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org> @ 2009-01-02 21:41 ` Peter Tury 2009-01-03 0:17 ` Peter Dyballa [not found] ` <mailman.3788.1230941851.26697.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org> 2009-01-02 21:41 ` Peter Tury 1 sibling, 2 replies; 7+ messages in thread From: Peter Tury @ 2009-01-02 21:41 UTC (permalink / raw) To: help-gnu-emacs Hi, thanks very much for the hints! I learned a lot from them, but my problem remained unchanged: cvs Emacs still uses an awfully big default font: now I thing this could be seen as a bug in current cvs version. What do you think? (Now I customized 'default' font to ":height 80" and this improved the sitution, but I think Emacs should be better at guessing defaults for 'default' font.) Based on https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-users/2007-October/126426.html and on http://xubuntulinux.blogspot.com/2006/07/ubuntu-set-correct-dpi-for-x-server.html ... I figured out that the actual dpi for my display is 129. http://mrmazda.no-ip.com/auth/dpi-screen-window.html prooved this. I set ~/.Xresources as follows: Xft.dpi: 129 Emacs.FontBackend: xft (is this unnecessary?) Also I set Gnome default fonts to 8pt. (Originally 96dpi was assumed by Gnome by default and bigger fonts were used system-wide: I had to change them when I set correct dpi values.) However, none of these affected Emacs: it still uses 11.8pt high fonts (previously it was 12pt)!? Where does this default come from? I guess that code should be improved. On 2008 dec. 28, 01:38, Peter Dyballa <Peter_Dyba...@Web.DE> wrote: > In KDE and GNOME there are rule settings about appropriate font > sizes. An optimised bitmapped font for 100 DPI is larger than the > same font for 75 DPI. When the X11 font path has the 100 DPI font > before the 75 DPI fonts than these larger fonts are used. How can I check if this is the case now for me? (I use Gnome on Ubuntu 8.10.) > GNU Emacs 23.0.60 uses libXft. When a 100 DPI display is assumed by Xft then > quite large 75 DPI fonts might be used ... I think now this can be ruled out in my case (becasue of my ~/.Xresources settings; see above). Am I right? > You could add to your X defaults a setting like this: > Xft.dpi: 96 > or a value closer to your display's resolution. It might also help to > run your X server with your display's resolution. Some X servers > evaluate the contents of a ~/.xserverrc file. Now it seem X server knows my real dpi and uses it correctly. Only Emacs wants to use strange size fonts. Thanks, P PS. Meanwhile I checked http://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/XftGnuEmacs also. It seems to be a bit outdated. Am I right? ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 7+ messages in thread
* Re: cvs emacs scales fonts to awfully big? 2009-01-02 21:41 ` Peter Tury @ 2009-01-03 0:17 ` Peter Dyballa [not found] ` <mailman.3788.1230941851.26697.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org> 1 sibling, 0 replies; 7+ messages in thread From: Peter Dyballa @ 2009-01-03 0:17 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Peter Tury; +Cc: help-gnu-emacs Am 02.01.2009 um 22:41 schrieb Peter Tury: > However, none of these affected Emacs: it still uses 11.8pt high fonts > (previously it was 12pt)!? Where does this default come from? I guess > that code should be improved. I think the default font size is set to be 16 pt – I've seen such LARGE characters at different times with Emacs versions on Macs and in MS Losedos. On a 129 DPI display it should be much larger to achieve the same readability! The actual font used can be determined by typing C-u C-x = on some character. You could also invoke M-x describe-fontset RET RET. > > On 2008 dec. 28, 01:38, Peter Dyballa <Peter_Dyba...@Web.DE> wrote: > >> In KDE and GNOME there are rule settings about appropriate font >> sizes. An optimised bitmapped font for 100 DPI is larger than the >> same font for 75 DPI. When the X11 font path has the 100 DPI font >> before the 75 DPI fonts than these larger fonts are used. > > How can I check if this is the case now for me? (I use Gnome on Ubuntu > 8.10.) xset -q > >> GNU Emacs 23.0.60 uses libXft. When a 100 DPI display is assumed >> by Xft then >> quite large 75 DPI fonts might be used ... > > I think now this can be ruled out in my case (becasue of my > ~/.Xresources settings; see above). > Am I right? Do you see these settings from 'xrdb -q | grep <some setting>' ? To me it looks as if GNU Emacs creates its startup fontset from either an X resource Emacs*font (I am using on a 100 or 96 DPI LCD -*- lucidatypewriter-medium-r-*-*-10-*-*-*-m-*-iso10646-1). This can be overwritten with font or fontset settings from initial-frame-alist and default-frame-alist. You can try this also on the command line: emacs [usual options etc] -xrm 'Emacs*font: <some XLFD>' & XLFD = X Logical Font Description, /usr/X11/share/X11/doc/hardcopy/ XLFD/xlfd.PS.gz Another option is to use the fonts menu (S-mouse-1). Here you can decrease the font size. Once you've found something useful you could choose "Save Options" from the Options menu. Could be it saves something meaningful in your init file! Have you tried to read the Emacs manual? C-h i ... There is also info- apropos. -- Greetings Pete Imbecility, n.: A kind of divine inspiration, or sacred fire affecting censorious critics of this dictionary. – Ambrose Bierce: _The Devil's Dictionary_ ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 7+ messages in thread
[parent not found: <mailman.3788.1230941851.26697.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>]
* Re: cvs emacs scales fonts to awfully big? [not found] ` <mailman.3788.1230941851.26697.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org> @ 2009-01-03 1:51 ` Peter Tury 2009-01-03 15:59 ` Peter Dyballa 0 siblings, 1 reply; 7+ messages in thread From: Peter Tury @ 2009-01-03 1:51 UTC (permalink / raw) To: help-gnu-emacs Hi, thanks again for your quick and detailed answer! On jan. 3, 01:17, Peter Dyballa <Peter_Dyba...@Web.DE> wrote: > Am 02.01.2009 um 22:41 schrieb Peter Tury: > > > However, none of these affected Emacs: it still uses 11.8pt high fonts > > (previously it was 12pt)!? I deduced these from `describe-face's result for 'default' face. It told: "Height: 118" (previously: 120). Doesn't this show the used font size? (After the customization mentioned earlier, now it tells: "Height: 79". This is fine for me.) > The actual font used can be determined by typing C-u C-x = on some > character. It gives me (after the customization, i.e. when I have normal size fonts): character: ( (40, #o50, #x28) preferred charset: ascii (ASCII (ISO646 IRV)) code point: 0x28 syntax: () which means: open, matches ) category: a:ASCII ASCII graphic characters 32-126 (ISO646 IRV:1983[4/0]) l:Latin r:Roman Japanese roman buffer code: #x28 file code: #x28 (encoded by coding system undecided-unix) display: by this font (glyph code) xft:-unknown-DejaVu Sans Mono-normal-normal-normal-*-14-*-*-*-m-0- iso10646-1 (#x0B) ... Does this mean 14pt size? When starting by Emacs -Q (i.e. in case of awfully big characters) it gives: character: a (97, #o141, #x61) preferred charset: ascii (ASCII (ISO646 IRV)) code point: 0x61 syntax: w which means: word category: a:ASCII ASCII graphic characters 32-126 (ISO646 IRV:1983[4/0]) l:Latin r:Roman Japanese roman buffer code: #x61 file code: #x61 (encoded by coding system utf-8-unix) display: by this font (glyph code) xft:-unknown-DejaVu Sans Mono-normal-normal-normal-*-21-*-*-*-m-0- iso10646-1 (#x44) ... 21pt? > You could also invoke M-x describe-fontset RET RET. > > > On 2008 dec. 28, 01:38, Peter Dyballa <Peter_Dyba...@Web.DE> wrote: > > >> In KDE and GNOME there are rule settings about appropriate font > >> sizes. An optimised bitmapped font for 100 DPI is larger than the > >> same font for 75 DPI. When the X11 font path has the 100 DPI font > >> before the 75 DPI fonts than these larger fonts are used. > > > How can I check if this is the case now for me? (I use Gnome on Ubuntu > > 8.10.) > > xset -q Yes, 100dpi libraries are indeed before the 75dpi ones. Should I change somehow their order? How is this possible? > >> GNU Emacs 23.0.60 uses libXft. When a 100 DPI display is assumed > >> by Xft then > >> quite large 75 DPI fonts might be used ... > > > I think now this can be ruled out in my case (becasue of my > > ~/.Xresources settings; see above). > > Am I right? > > Do you see these settings from 'xrdb -q | grep <some setting>' ? Yes, both of my manual settings (Xft.dpi and Emacs.FontBackend) can be seen as I set them (129 and xft). > To me it looks as if GNU Emacs creates its startup fontset from > either an X resource Emacs*font I checked xrdb -q | grep Emacs and it contains only colors (except what I set manually -- fontbackend). Should I check something else too? > This can be > overwritten with font or fontset settings from initial-frame-alist > and default-frame-alist. You can try this also on the command line: > > emacs [usual options etc] -xrm 'Emacs*font: <some XLFD>' & > > XLFD = X Logical Font Description, /usr/X11/share/X11/doc/hardcopy/ > XLFD/xlfd.PS.gz I'll try this, thanks for the hint! (Now I get the huge fonts when I start Emacs with -Q for this "troublshooting", so I got rid of my normal -frame-alist settings...; otherwise the customization saved into .emacs results in smaller fonts.) > Another option is to use the fonts menu (S-mouse-1). Here you can > decrease the font size. Once you've found something useful you could > choose "Save Options" from the Options menu. Could be it saves > something meaningful in your init file! > > Have you tried to read the Emacs manual? C-h i ... There is also info- > apropos. Thanks, I tried these. As I wrote, I have a solution what works, so I can use Emacs. What I use now is the permanet customization of the 'default' face. Now I would like to know if it is a bug that normal working can be achieved only by some manual customizations? (In other words: I think Emacs should find the proper font sizes as other applications find them by default.) Thanks, P ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 7+ messages in thread
* Re: cvs emacs scales fonts to awfully big? 2009-01-03 1:51 ` Peter Tury @ 2009-01-03 15:59 ` Peter Dyballa 0 siblings, 0 replies; 7+ messages in thread From: Peter Dyballa @ 2009-01-03 15:59 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Peter Tury; +Cc: help-gnu-emacs Am 03.01.2009 um 02:51 schrieb Peter Tury: >> >> >>> However, none of these affected Emacs: it still uses 11.8pt high >>> fonts >>> (previously it was 12pt)!? > > I deduced these from `describe-face's result for 'default' face. It > told: "Height: 118" (previously: 120). Doesn't this show the used font > size? (After the customization mentioned earlier, now it tells: > "Height: 79". This is fine for me.) The XLFD has a pixel size and a point size. The latter is ten times the former. > >> The actual font used can be determined by typing C-u C-x = on some >> character. > > It gives me (after the customization, i.e. when I have normal size > fonts): > character: ( (40, #o50, #x28) > preferred charset: ascii (ASCII (ISO646 IRV)) > code point: 0x28 > syntax: () which means: open, matches ) > category: a:ASCII > ASCII graphic characters 32-126 (ISO646 IRV:1983[4/0]) l:Latin r:Roman > Japanese roman > buffer code: #x28 > file code: #x28 (encoded by coding system undecided-unix) > display: by this font (glyph code) > xft:-unknown-DejaVu Sans Mono-normal-normal-normal-*-14-*-*-*-m-0- > iso10646-1 (#x0B) You can see that the font was selected via libXft. > > Does this mean 14pt size? Yes! But (point) size in pixels. > > When starting by Emacs -Q (i.e. in case of awfully big characters) it > gives: > > character: a (97, #o141, #x61) > preferred charset: ascii (ASCII (ISO646 IRV)) > code point: 0x61 > syntax: w which means: word > category: a:ASCII > ASCII graphic characters 32-126 (ISO646 IRV:1983[4/0]) l:Latin r:Roman > Japanese roman > buffer code: #x61 > file code: #x61 (encoded by coding system utf-8-unix) > display: by this font (glyph code) > xft:-unknown-DejaVu Sans Mono-normal-normal-normal-*-21-*-*-*-m-0- > iso10646-1 (#x44) > ... > > 21pt? Yes, and obviously trying to accommodate the 16pt (or now 14pt?) default to the display's resolution. Notice that the resx and resy fields are unspecified, so any 75 DPI or 100 DPI font, whichever comes first, matches this specification. Have you ever tried xfontsel? >> >> xset -q > > Yes, 100dpi libraries are indeed before the 75dpi ones. Should I > change somehow their order? How is this possible? In your ~/.xinitrc or ~/.xsession file, whichever is used, you can insert/correct: xset fp= /path/1/,/path/2/,/path/3/ xset fp rehash See man xset. Usually one uses 'xset fp+ ...' or 'xset +fp ...', i.e., one appends or prepends local additional font path elements (directories) to the compile time default. >> To me it looks as if GNU Emacs creates its startup fontset from >> either an X resource Emacs*font > > I checked xrdb -q | grep Emacs and it contains only colors (except > what I set manually -- fontbackend). Should I check something else > too? It's your decision! The GNU Emacs info node has some documentation on X resources. > > Now I would like to know if it is a bug that normal working can be > achieved only by some manual customizations? It's not: it's a design decision. Maybe it has to be corrected for modern LCD screens. This could be done by choosing to report an Emacs bug (Help menu) and changing the subject of the eMail to the developers from bug report to something more appropriate. > (In other words: I think Emacs should find the proper font sizes as > other applications find them by default.) > IMO it does! I let it use Emacs*font: -*-lucidatypewriter-medium-r-*-*-10-*-*-*-m-*- iso10646-1 and x:-b&h-lucidatypewriter-medium-r-normal-sans-10-100-75-75-m-60- iso8859-1 is used for an ASCII character (libXft on my Mac is from last millennium or elder and therefore unusable). If no X resource is defined and no font or fontset is set in *-frame-alist a default in C source code is used as last resort. This sounds quite rational. -- Greetings Pete One cannot live by television, video games, top ten CDs, and dumb movies alone. – Amiri Baraka, 1999 ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 7+ messages in thread
* Re: cvs emacs scales fonts to awfully big? [not found] ` <mailman.3422.1230424737.26697.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org> 2009-01-02 21:41 ` Peter Tury @ 2009-01-02 21:41 ` Peter Tury 1 sibling, 0 replies; 7+ messages in thread From: Peter Tury @ 2009-01-02 21:41 UTC (permalink / raw) To: help-gnu-emacs Hi, thanks very much for the hints! I learned a lot from them, but my problem remained unchanged: cvs Emacs still uses an awfully big default font: now I thing this could be seen as a bug in current cvs version. What do you think? (Now I customized 'default' font to ":height 80" and this improved the sitution, but I think Emacs should be better at guessing defaults for 'default' font.) Based on https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-users/2007-October/126426.html and on http://xubuntulinux.blogspot.com/2006/07/ubuntu-set-correct-dpi-for-x-server.html ... I figured out that the actual dpi for my display is 129. http://mrmazda.no-ip.com/auth/dpi-screen-window.html prooved this. I set ~/.Xresources as follows: Xft.dpi: 129 Emacs.FontBackend: xft (is this unnecessary?) Also I set Gnome default fonts to 8pt. (Originally 96dpi was assumed by Gnome by default and bigger fonts were used system-wide: I had to change them when I set correct dpi values.) However, none of these affected Emacs: it still uses 11.8pt high fonts (previously it was 12pt)!? Where does this default come from? I guess that code should be improved. On 2008 dec. 28, 01:38, Peter Dyballa <Peter_Dyba...@Web.DE> wrote: > In KDE and GNOME there are rule settings about appropriate font > sizes. An optimised bitmapped font for 100 DPI is larger than the > same font for 75 DPI. When the X11 font path has the 100 DPI font > before the 75 DPI fonts than these larger fonts are used. How can I check if this is the case now for me? (I use Gnome on Ubuntu 8.10.) > GNU Emacs 23.0.60 uses libXft. When a 100 DPI display is assumed by Xft then > quite large 75 DPI fonts might be used ... I think now this can be ruled out in my case (becasue of my ~/.Xresources settings; see above). Am I right? > You could add to your X defaults a setting like this: > Xft.dpi: 96 > or a value closer to your display's resolution. It might also help to > run your X server with your display's resolution. Some X servers > evaluate the contents of a ~/.xserverrc file. Now it seem X server knows my real dpi and uses it correctly. Only Emacs wants to use strange size fonts. Thanks, P PS. Meanwhile I checked http://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/XftGnuEmacs also. It seems to be a bit outdated. Am I right? ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 7+ messages in thread
end of thread, other threads:[~2009-01-03 15:59 UTC | newest] Thread overview: 7+ messages (download: mbox.gz follow: Atom feed -- links below jump to the message on this page -- 2008-12-27 23:18 cvs emacs scales fonts to awfully big? Peter Tury 2008-12-28 0:38 ` Peter Dyballa [not found] ` <mailman.3422.1230424737.26697.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org> 2009-01-02 21:41 ` Peter Tury 2009-01-03 0:17 ` Peter Dyballa [not found] ` <mailman.3788.1230941851.26697.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org> 2009-01-03 1:51 ` Peter Tury 2009-01-03 15:59 ` Peter Dyballa 2009-01-02 21:41 ` Peter Tury
Code repositories for project(s) associated with this external index https://git.savannah.gnu.org/cgit/emacs.git https://git.savannah.gnu.org/cgit/emacs/org-mode.git This is an external index of several public inboxes, see mirroring instructions on how to clone and mirror all data and code used by this external index.