From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Drew Adams Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: RE: How to opt out of curly-quote spamming altogether? Date: Mon, 24 Aug 2015 10:06:31 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: References: <> <<83fv38hfsx.fsf@gnu.org>> <> <<837fokhby1.fsf@gnu.org>> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1440436021 1719 80.91.229.3 (24 Aug 2015 17:07:01 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 24 Aug 2015 17:07:01 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Eli Zaretskii , Drew Adams Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Mon Aug 24 19:06:46 2015 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1ZTvCn-0002hP-Ku for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 24 Aug 2015 19:06:45 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:55624 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZTvCm-00074q-Ph for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 24 Aug 2015 13:06:44 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:59672) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZTvCj-00074L-8a for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 24 Aug 2015 13:06:42 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZTvCi-0003hq-2r for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 24 Aug 2015 13:06:41 -0400 Original-Received: from userp1040.oracle.com ([156.151.31.81]:28215) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZTvCd-0003em-Se; Mon, 24 Aug 2015 13:06:36 -0400 Original-Received: from userv0021.oracle.com (userv0021.oracle.com [156.151.31.71]) by userp1040.oracle.com (Sentrion-MTA-4.3.2/Sentrion-MTA-4.3.2) with ESMTP id t7OH6Xfb021428 (version=TLSv1 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 24 Aug 2015 17:06:35 GMT Original-Received: from aserv0121.oracle.com (aserv0121.oracle.com [141.146.126.235]) by userv0021.oracle.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id t7OH6XvA025137 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 24 Aug 2015 17:06:33 GMT Original-Received: from abhmp0014.oracle.com (abhmp0014.oracle.com [141.146.116.20]) by aserv0121.oracle.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id t7OH6Xpw014023; Mon, 24 Aug 2015 17:06:33 GMT In-Reply-To: <<837fokhby1.fsf@gnu.org>> X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Oracle Beehive Extensions for Outlook 2.0.1.9 (901082) [OL 12.0.6691.5000 (x86)] X-Source-IP: userv0021.oracle.com [156.151.31.71] X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.4.x-2.6.x [generic] X-Received-From: 156.151.31.81 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:189111 Archived-At: > > That's horrible. Users should be able to control this, easily. >=20 > Why? We don't have easy controls for displaying one character as > another. Why should these characters be different? This is not about "displaying one character as another." It is about choosing how to present inline code fragments. It is not about substituting for literal curly quotes everwhere, as I made clear. > > I don't see this problem in a Windows binary from 2014-11-30. The > > regression was apparently introduced to the Windows builds between > > then and 2014-12-29. >=20 > It's the question of which version of Texinfo was used for producing > the docs. The defaults in Texinfo changed recently, independently > of Emacs development. Defaults? So Emacs has a choice? > > A display-table hack would presumably change all uses of a curly > > quote. >=20 > A display table can be specific to a buffer or a window. See the > ELisp manual for more about that. I don't see how that would help anyone. It's too late, once the curly quotes are hard-coded in the output. There is no reasonable way for a user at that point to tell Emacs which occurrences represent presentation of inline code and which really belong as literal curly quotes. > But it was you that asked for a switch that changed them > _everywhere_, which is why I suggested standard-display-table, > which is global. Disingenuous. You know full well what I'm talking about: undoing the use of curly quotes to replace `...'. And yes, that everywhere. But certainly not _replacing_ all occurrences of curly quotes, including any that have nothing to do with inline code (`...'). > > That's not appropriate - it is only the code-"quoting" > > uses that need to be changable/configurable by a user. >=20 > What is "code-'quoting'"? An Info manual is not code, it's mostly > text, but you still wanted these characters changed there. The use of `...' has primarily been to set off inline code fragments from the surrounding text. It has also been used sometimes for URLs, file names, and some links, but those uses are arguably inappropriate. Use whatever phrase you like, but you know, I think, that I am referring to the replacement of `...' by wrapping with curly quotes, and only that.