From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Miles Bader Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Key bindings proposal Date: Fri, 06 Aug 2010 14:09:49 +0900 Message-ID: References: <19534.1494.627000.357123@gargle.gargle.HOWL> <19537.40472.267000.563053@gargle.gargle.HOWL> <176EDAD3B9E54E39870FA3F84A5DDF3C@us.oracle.com> <19542.56658.583000.394397@gargle.gargle.HOWL> <19544.1015.468000.280770@gargle.gargle.HOWL> <19546.30901.687000.971249@gargle.gargle.HOWL> <19546.47167.15000.439215@gargle.gargle.HOWL> <87fwys7qao.fsf@telefonica.net> <87hbj8qvd9.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> Reply-To: Miles Bader NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: dough.gmane.org 1281071411 1199 80.91.229.12 (6 Aug 2010 05:10:11 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@dough.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2010 05:10:11 +0000 (UTC) Cc: =?iso-8859-1?Q?=D3scar?= Fuentes , emacs-devel@gnu.org To: "Stephen J. Turnbull" Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Fri Aug 06 07:10:08 2010 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1OhFC1-0002YZ-Lu for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 06 Aug 2010 07:10:06 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:38469 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1OhFBz-0002ng-KS for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 06 Aug 2010 01:10:03 -0400 Original-Received: from [140.186.70.92] (port=41810 helo=eggs.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1OhFBs-0002mr-CR for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 06 Aug 2010 01:09:57 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1OhFBq-0007D4-BD for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 06 Aug 2010 01:09:55 -0400 Original-Received: from tyo202.gate.nec.co.jp ([202.32.8.206]:36975) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1OhFBp-0007Ck-Sa; Fri, 06 Aug 2010 01:09:54 -0400 Original-Received: from mailgate3.nec.co.jp ([10.7.69.192]) by tyo202.gate.nec.co.jp (8.13.8/8.13.4) with ESMTP id o7659p5A023690; Fri, 6 Aug 2010 14:09:51 +0900 (JST) Original-Received: (from root@localhost) by mailgate3.nec.co.jp (8.11.7/3.7W-MAILGATE-NEC) id o7659pS21948; Fri, 6 Aug 2010 14:09:51 +0900 (JST) Original-Received: from relay11.aps.necel.com ([10.29.19.46]) by vgate01.nec.co.jp (8.11.7/3.7W-MAILSV-NEC) with ESMTP id o7659oL00038; Fri, 6 Aug 2010 14:09:50 +0900 (JST) Original-Received: from relay11.aps.necel.com ([10.29.19.16] [10.29.19.16]) by relay11.aps.necel.com with ESMTP; Fri, 6 Aug 2010 14:09:50 +0900 Original-Received: from dhlpc061 ([10.114.113.21] [10.114.113.21]) by relay11.aps.necel.com with ESMTP; Fri, 6 Aug 2010 14:09:50 +0900 Original-Received: by dhlpc061 (Postfix, from userid 31295) id 227C052E23D; Fri, 6 Aug 2010 14:09:50 +0900 (JST) System-Type: x86_64-unknown-linux-gnu Blat: Foop In-Reply-To: <87hbj8qvd9.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> (Stephen J. Turnbull's message of "Fri, 06 Aug 2010 12:21:22 +0900") Original-Lines: 26 X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Solaris 8 (1) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:128354 Archived-At: "Stephen J. Turnbull" writes: > It's not essential, but I really appreciate having Meta on the outside > (where my little finger can press it). It's also nice in X because of > the number of window managers that willy-nilly steal Alt for their own > use. I'm a bit confused about how the alt-meta split actually happens in X, because I've found it _extremely_ hard to get any kind of consistent behavior (across systems, even those running the same OS / version, and across apps). In particular, it seems to depend on the type of keyboard you use (USB vs. PS/2), and Emacs does not recognize modifier mappings that other apps do, so I get the feeling Emacs may be using reading keyboard input at a different level than most apps (e.g., logical vs. physical or something?). I dunno. It's a mess in X generally, but it seems even more of a mess in X+Emacs... It's hard even to describe the problem well enough to come up with a real bug report... -Miles -- History, n. An account mostly false, of events mostly unimportant, which are brought about by rulers mostly knaves, and soldiers mostly fools.