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From: Dmitry Gutov <dgutov@yandex.ru>
To: Yuri Khan <yuri.v.khan@gmail.com>
Cc: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi@gnus.org>,
	Gregory Heytings <gregory@heytings.org>,
	Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org>,
	Stefan Kangas <stefankangas@gmail.com>,
	Emacs developers <emacs-devel@gnu.org>
Subject: Re: Suggested experimental test
Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2021 15:20:43 +0200	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <b9d05efb-b491-c72d-c130-af6a1b7b66f4@yandex.ru> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <CAP_d_8VAd5RRhmJgXwntFuPv1gPx3O5YDvth7PNcpgp7UmZ_KA@mail.gmail.com>

On 25.03.2021 08:12, Yuri Khan wrote:
> On Thu, 25 Mar 2021 at 06:41, Dmitry Gutov <dgutov@yandex.ru> wrote:
> 
>>> we should have a bulletproof way to move things off
>>> C-x and C-c.
>>
>> I think there are basically two directions:
>>
>> - Find two other C-<char> prefix key combinations to move the main
>> prefix keymaps to. C-d and C-e come to mind (basically all other keys
>> that are situated closer to Ctrl or Caps on a qwerty keyboard are all
>> taken up by popular bindings such as C-a "select all" or C-s "save file").
> 
> What, being close to (left) Ctrl on a QWERTY is/was a consideration
> when choosing C-x and C-c? This makes sense, as much as it does for
> Undo/Cut/Copy/Paste.

It surely needs to be comfortable to press with one hand.

>> - Go all the way to VS Code/Atom/Notepad/etc approach and depopulate
>> these prefix maps. And then use two modifiers at a time for the
>> important commands/prefix maps which we still need to have bindings. For
>> example, that would move 'C-x v' to 'C-M-g' and 'C-x C-i' to 'C-M-o', or
>> similar.
> 
> In my personal bindings, I do prefer C-M-, C-S- and M-S- combinations
> to sequences. (Also function keys and their C- and S- combinations.)

Not my preference, but that seems to reflect the bindings I see "out 
there". So you could be a good person to gauge to alternative bindings 
theme.

> But, while I can (mostly) rebind something to ctl-x-map, in order to
> move things off C-c, I’d have to basically copy every mode’s map into
> my configuration and replace C-c with <menu>. Alternatively, I could
> use some key translation mechanism to pretend <menu> produces C-c and
> C-c produces <XF86Copy> or some such, but I’m not sure if that would
> also affect sequences where C-c is not the first key (and I’d probably
> like it not to).

Yeah, C-x seems easier, because at least built-in code uses ctl-x-map 
(which you can move wholesale) and 3rd party packages can be asked to.

But C-c doesn't have a dedicated keymap, so solving this seems like the 
first step. What could we do?

   (kbd (format "%s C-l" ctl-c-key-sequence) 'some-command)

?

Or maybe create a bogus ctrl-c keymap and then make sure to refer to its 
binding with something like

   (kbd "[C-c] C-l" 'some-command)

...I'm not sure, ideas welcome. Something backward-compatible would be 
ideal.



  reply	other threads:[~2021-03-25 13:20 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 171+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2021-03-20  9:03 Suggested experimental test Gregory Heytings
2021-03-20 11:14 ` Jean Louis
2021-03-20 11:27   ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-20 11:34   ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-20 12:37 ` Proposal to remove C-o binding [was: Suggested experimental test] Alan Mackenzie
2021-03-21  6:53 ` Suggested experimental test Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-21  8:35   ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-21 13:20     ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-21 18:16       ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-21 22:16         ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-21 22:54           ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-21 23:05             ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-21 23:13               ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-21 23:46                 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-22  0:40                   ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-22 10:05                     ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-22 18:14                       ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-22 19:06                         ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-22 19:56                           ` [External] : " Drew Adams
2021-03-22 21:03                             ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-22 21:26                               ` Drew Adams
2021-03-23  8:06                                 ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-22 21:08                           ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-22 11:21                   ` Jean Louis
2021-03-22 11:07               ` Jean Louis
2021-03-22  3:33           ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-22 10:05             ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-22 11:37               ` Philip Kaludercic
2021-03-22 12:20                 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-22 17:38               ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-22 17:48                 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-22 18:11                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-22 18:15                   ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-22 18:14               ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-22  8:59           ` Rudolf Schlatte
2021-03-22 10:05             ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-22 10:49           ` Jean Louis
2021-03-21 10:48   ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-21 10:58     ` Sv: " arthur miller
2021-03-21 13:20       ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-21 18:16       ` Sv: " Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-22  5:11         ` Richard Stallman
2021-03-22 10:24       ` Sv: " Jean Louis
2021-03-22 10:14     ` Jean Louis
2021-03-22 12:06     ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-22 12:23       ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-22 16:15         ` Jean Louis
2021-03-22 16:14       ` Jean Louis
2021-03-22 17:08         ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-22 17:46           ` Alan Mackenzie
2021-03-22 17:59             ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-22 18:23             ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-23  6:09             ` Richard Stallman
2021-03-22 18:03           ` Jean Louis
2021-03-22 17:20       ` Robin Tarsiger
2021-03-22 17:40       ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-22 17:55         ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-22 18:13           ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-22 20:22             ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-23  8:06               ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-23 14:15                 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-23 14:37                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-23 16:51                     ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-23 17:13                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-23 18:08                       ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-23 21:06                         ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-23 21:43                           ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-23 21:57                             ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-23 22:08                               ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-23 22:14                                 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-23 22:42                                   ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-23 23:05                                     ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-24  5:15                                 ` Richard Stallman
2021-03-24  5:16                           ` Richard Stallman
2021-03-24  6:39                           ` Jean Louis
2021-03-24  6:32                       ` Jean Louis
2021-03-24  6:10                   ` Jean Louis
2021-03-22 18:17         ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-22 18:50           ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-22 19:09             ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-22 19:55               ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-22 22:02                 ` Stefan Kangas
2021-03-22 22:33                   ` [External] : " Drew Adams
2021-03-22 23:28                     ` Stefan Kangas
2021-03-22 22:44                   ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-03-22 23:22                     ` Stefan Kangas
2021-03-23  5:22                     ` Jean Louis
2021-03-23  7:43                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-23 12:28                         ` Philip Kaludercic
2021-03-23 12:41                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-23 13:09                             ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-03-23 13:27                               ` Philip Kaludercic
2021-03-23 14:00                                 ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-03-23 13:54                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-23 17:04                                 ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-03-23 21:06                                 ` chad
2021-03-24  5:07                             ` Jean Louis
2021-03-25  5:09                               ` Richard Stallman
2021-03-23  6:12                     ` Yuri Khan
2021-03-24 23:41                       ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-03-25  6:12                         ` Yuri Khan
2021-03-25 13:20                           ` Dmitry Gutov [this message]
2021-03-25 14:30                             ` Basil L. Contovounesios
2021-03-25 17:09                               ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-03-25 18:59                               ` Yuri Khan
2021-03-25 19:30                             ` Yuri Khan
2021-03-25 21:11                               ` Stefan Monnier
2021-03-25 23:54                                 ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-03-26 10:34                                   ` Stefan Kangas
2021-03-26 23:13                                     ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-03-26 23:34                               ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-03-27  0:02                                 ` Stefan Monnier
2021-03-28 13:59                                   ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-03-22 20:22               ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-22 20:36                 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-22 21:03                   ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-22 20:56         ` Thierry Volpiatto
2021-03-22 18:11       ` [EXTERNAL] " Stephan Mueller
2021-03-22 18:34         ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-22 18:56           ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-22 19:13             ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-22 19:19               ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-22 19:25                 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-22 19:49                   ` Stefan Monnier
2021-03-22 19:52                     ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-22 20:54                       ` Stefan Monnier
2021-03-22 21:04                         ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-23  7:18                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-22 19:21               ` chad
2021-03-22 19:26                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-22 19:51                   ` Stefan Monnier
2021-03-22 20:04                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-22 20:11                       ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-22 20:16                         ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-23  7:04                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-22 20:49                       ` Stefan Monnier
2021-03-22 21:02                         ` [External] : " Drew Adams
2021-03-23  7:09                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-22 19:28                 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-22 19:56                   ` [External] : " Drew Adams
2021-03-22 20:56                     ` Stefan Monnier
2021-03-22 21:19                       ` Drew Adams
2021-03-22 20:22             ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-23  8:09               ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-23 14:15                 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-23 14:31                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-23 17:21                   ` Bob Rogers
2021-03-24  5:42                   ` Jean Louis
2021-03-23 20:55                 ` chad
2021-03-25 17:04           ` [EXTERNAL] " Stephan Mueller
2021-03-22 19:37         ` Stefan Monnier
2021-03-22 19:42         ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-03-22 20:33       ` Jose A. Ortega Ruiz
2021-03-22 18:42     ` Sean Whitton
  -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2021-03-23 21:51 Paul W. Rankin via Emacs development discussions.
2021-03-24  8:34 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-24  8:51   ` tomas
2021-03-24  9:16     ` Paul W. Rankin via Emacs development discussions.
2021-03-24  9:22       ` tomas
2021-03-24 10:37     ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-24 11:13       ` tomas
2021-03-24 11:51         ` Jean Louis
2021-03-24 11:55           ` tomas
2021-03-25  5:14           ` Richard Stallman
2021-03-24 17:04         ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-24 17:19           ` tomas
2021-03-24 17:30         ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-03-24 20:08           ` tomas
2021-03-25  5:14       ` Richard Stallman
2021-03-25  5:48         ` Paul W. Rankin via Emacs development discussions.
2021-03-25  7:46         ` Eli Zaretskii

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