* Re: Org-mode 'organized' visibility
[not found] <20060823131338.GA32711@zoidberg.homeip.net>
@ 2006-08-24 6:28 ` Carsten Dominik
2006-08-24 20:17 ` Eddward DeVilla
0 siblings, 1 reply; 3+ messages in thread
From: Carsten Dominik @ 2006-08-24 6:28 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Casper Gripenberg; +Cc: emacs-orgmode
Hi Caspar,
On Aug 23, 2006, at 15:13, Casper Gripenberg wrote:
> Hi..is it possible to not make S-TAB collapse
> empty spaces between items. If I have a long
> list of items I like to organize them into
> groups..and then when I collapse the whole
> tree I'd like my groupings it to be visible like this:
>
> * Tasks...
>
> * Something important...
> * Something related to above...
>
> * Something else not related...
> * Again related...
> * Related...
>
> * Not related...
>
> Instead of the current way:
>
> * Tasks...
> * Something important...
> * Something related to above...
> * Something else not related...
> * Again related...
> * Related...
> * Not related...
>
> ..which doesn't allow me to see the groupings
> between the tasks I have. I just think grouping provides
> much quicker visual feedback of the tasks/headlines and
> their relations to each other.
>
> To implement the groupings you might have a rule that
> more than two empty lines between two headings will
> then activate 'grouping'.
>
> So if I have:
>
> * Important
>
> Blah blah
>
> * Related
>
> Blah blah
>
>
> * Not related
>
> This would collapse into:
>
> * Important...
> * Related...
>
> * Not related...
>
> Or something along those lines..is that possible to
> do somehow?
>
> Thanks..
>
> Regards,
> Casper
This is something outside the direct control of Org-mode, it is
entirely done by outline-mode. Looking at outline.el, I see two
possibilities to address this:
1. For this first one, you need a current version of Emacs (must be
CVS, Emacs 21 does not have this). Outline has an undocumented feature
which makes it possible to relate an empty line before a heading to the
heading. So when the heading is shown, the empty line is shows along
with it. Similarly, a subtree is then defined to be before that empty
line. As I said, this is an undocumented feature in so far as the
corresponding variable is not customizable. However, you can still set
it in the old way using
(setq outline-blank-line t)
If you do it in this way, there will be no difference between a single
or a double empty line. An empty line before a heading will create an
empty line in the CONTENT and CHILDREN views of org-cycle.
2. If we insist on your convention on using two line to mark a
separation (we should, because it is the better convention), you would
have to redefine a function in outline. This is not clean, but who
gives a s*** :-) And I like this convention better, because I very
often want to have an empty line above a headline without it meaning a
separation.
The function to modify is outline-show-heading, and it must be modified
after outline.el has been loaded. If you are only using outline in
connection with Org-mode, here is a way to do this:
(add-hook 'org-load-hook
(lambda ()
(defun outline-show-heading ()
"Show the current heading and move to its end."
(outline-flag-region
(- (point)
(cond
((bobp) 0)
((equal (buffer-substring
(max (point-min) (- (point) 3)) (point))
"\n\n\n")
2)
(t 1)))
(progn (outline-end-of-heading) (point))
nil))))
If you want this for other uses of outline as well, you could use
`eval-after-load' or defadvice to achieve this change.
There is a small possibility that doing either of these things might
break something else in org-mode. I don't think so, but maybe I am not
overseeing it fully. If you see something strange, let me know.
Hope this helps.
- Carsten
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 3+ messages in thread
* Re: Re: Org-mode 'organized' visibility
2006-08-24 6:28 ` Org-mode 'organized' visibility Carsten Dominik
@ 2006-08-24 20:17 ` Eddward DeVilla
2006-08-25 7:01 ` Carsten Dominik
0 siblings, 1 reply; 3+ messages in thread
From: Eddward DeVilla @ 2006-08-24 20:17 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Carsten Dominik; +Cc: Casper Gripenberg, emacs-orgmode
I don't know if I'm following or not. I think I get the grouping you
are after. If trailing blank line are empty it does not collapse into
the text for a heading. If it is blank, but contains white space
character, it does collapse.
So I am able to do the following
------
* heading
I have something to say
<space or tab>
*heading 2
I have more to say
* unrelated heading
Now for something completely different
------
And this will collapse down to
------
* heading
* heading 2
* unrelated heading
------
Along these lines, I used to wish for something like a horizontal line
that I could throw in between 'sections'. For the moment, I have a
layout style that looks fine without it and without playing too many
games with trailing blank (but not empty) lines.
On 8/24/06, Carsten Dominik <dominik@science.uva.nl> wrote:
> Hi Caspar,
>
> On Aug 23, 2006, at 15:13, Casper Gripenberg wrote:
>
> > Hi..is it possible to not make S-TAB collapse
> > empty spaces between items. If I have a long
> > list of items I like to organize them into
> > groups..and then when I collapse the whole
> > tree I'd like my groupings it to be visible like this:
> >
> > * Tasks...
> >
> > * Something important...
> > * Something related to above...
> >
> > * Something else not related...
> > * Again related...
> > * Related...
> >
> > * Not related...
> >
> > Instead of the current way:
> >
> > * Tasks...
> > * Something important...
> > * Something related to above...
> > * Something else not related...
> > * Again related...
> > * Related...
> > * Not related...
> >
> > ..which doesn't allow me to see the groupings
> > between the tasks I have. I just think grouping provides
> > much quicker visual feedback of the tasks/headlines and
> > their relations to each other.
> >
> > To implement the groupings you might have a rule that
> > more than two empty lines between two headings will
> > then activate 'grouping'.
> >
> > So if I have:
> >
> > * Important
> >
> > Blah blah
> >
> > * Related
> >
> > Blah blah
> >
> >
> > * Not related
> >
> > This would collapse into:
> >
> > * Important...
> > * Related...
> >
> > * Not related...
> >
> > Or something along those lines..is that possible to
> > do somehow?
> >
> > Thanks..
> >
> > Regards,
> > Casper
>
> This is something outside the direct control of Org-mode, it is
> entirely done by outline-mode. Looking at outline.el, I see two
> possibilities to address this:
>
> 1. For this first one, you need a current version of Emacs (must be
> CVS, Emacs 21 does not have this). Outline has an undocumented feature
> which makes it possible to relate an empty line before a heading to the
> heading. So when the heading is shown, the empty line is shows along
> with it. Similarly, a subtree is then defined to be before that empty
> line. As I said, this is an undocumented feature in so far as the
> corresponding variable is not customizable. However, you can still set
> it in the old way using
>
> (setq outline-blank-line t)
>
> If you do it in this way, there will be no difference between a single
> or a double empty line. An empty line before a heading will create an
> empty line in the CONTENT and CHILDREN views of org-cycle.
>
> 2. If we insist on your convention on using two line to mark a
> separation (we should, because it is the better convention), you would
> have to redefine a function in outline. This is not clean, but who
> gives a s*** :-) And I like this convention better, because I very
> often want to have an empty line above a headline without it meaning a
> separation.
>
> The function to modify is outline-show-heading, and it must be modified
> after outline.el has been loaded. If you are only using outline in
> connection with Org-mode, here is a way to do this:
>
> (add-hook 'org-load-hook
> (lambda ()
> (defun outline-show-heading ()
> "Show the current heading and move to its end."
> (outline-flag-region
> (- (point)
> (cond
> ((bobp) 0)
> ((equal (buffer-substring
> (max (point-min) (- (point) 3)) (point))
> "\n\n\n")
> 2)
> (t 1)))
> (progn (outline-end-of-heading) (point))
> nil))))
>
> If you want this for other uses of outline as well, you could use
> `eval-after-load' or defadvice to achieve this change.
>
> There is a small possibility that doing either of these things might
> break something else in org-mode. I don't think so, but maybe I am not
> overseeing it fully. If you see something strange, let me know.
>
> Hope this helps.
>
> - Carsten
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Emacs-orgmode mailing list
> Emacs-orgmode@gnu.org
> http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/emacs-orgmode
>
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 3+ messages in thread
* Re: Re: Org-mode 'organized' visibility
2006-08-24 20:17 ` Eddward DeVilla
@ 2006-08-25 7:01 ` Carsten Dominik
0 siblings, 0 replies; 3+ messages in thread
From: Carsten Dominik @ 2006-08-25 7:01 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Eddward DeVilla; +Cc: Casper Gripenberg, emacs-orgmode
This is again different behavior on Emacs 21 and Emacs 22. What I have
been describing was Emacs 22 behavior. It seems that the Emacs 21
behavior is about the same as Emacs 22 with outline-blank-lines set to
t.
- Carsten
On Aug 24, 2006, at 22:17, Eddward DeVilla wrote:
> I don't know if I'm following or not. I think I get the grouping you
> are after. If trailing blank line are empty it does not collapse into
> the text for a heading. If it is blank, but contains white space
> character, it does collapse.
>
> So I am able to do the following
>
> ------
> * heading
> I have something to say
> <space or tab>
> *heading 2
> I have more to say
>
> * unrelated heading
> Now for something completely different
>
> ------
>
> And this will collapse down to
>
> ------
> * heading
> * heading 2
>
> * unrelated heading
>
> ------
>
> Along these lines, I used to wish for something like a horizontal line
> that I could throw in between 'sections'. For the moment, I have a
> layout style that looks fine without it and without playing too many
> games with trailing blank (but not empty) lines.
>
> On 8/24/06, Carsten Dominik <dominik@science.uva.nl> wrote:
>> Hi Caspar,
>>
>> On Aug 23, 2006, at 15:13, Casper Gripenberg wrote:
>>
>> > Hi..is it possible to not make S-TAB collapse
>> > empty spaces between items. If I have a long
>> > list of items I like to organize them into
>> > groups..and then when I collapse the whole
>> > tree I'd like my groupings it to be visible like this:
>> >
>> > * Tasks...
>> >
>> > * Something important...
>> > * Something related to above...
>> >
>> > * Something else not related...
>> > * Again related...
>> > * Related...
>> >
>> > * Not related...
>> >
>> > Instead of the current way:
>> >
>> > * Tasks...
>> > * Something important...
>> > * Something related to above...
>> > * Something else not related...
>> > * Again related...
>> > * Related...
>> > * Not related...
>> >
>> > ..which doesn't allow me to see the groupings
>> > between the tasks I have. I just think grouping provides
>> > much quicker visual feedback of the tasks/headlines and
>> > their relations to each other.
>> >
>> > To implement the groupings you might have a rule that
>> > more than two empty lines between two headings will
>> > then activate 'grouping'.
>> >
>> > So if I have:
>> >
>> > * Important
>> >
>> > Blah blah
>> >
>> > * Related
>> >
>> > Blah blah
>> >
>> >
>> > * Not related
>> >
>> > This would collapse into:
>> >
>> > * Important...
>> > * Related...
>> >
>> > * Not related...
>> >
>> > Or something along those lines..is that possible to
>> > do somehow?
>> >
>> > Thanks..
>> >
>> > Regards,
>> > Casper
>>
>> This is something outside the direct control of Org-mode, it is
>> entirely done by outline-mode. Looking at outline.el, I see two
>> possibilities to address this:
>>
>> 1. For this first one, you need a current version of Emacs (must be
>> CVS, Emacs 21 does not have this). Outline has an undocumented
>> feature
>> which makes it possible to relate an empty line before a heading to
>> the
>> heading. So when the heading is shown, the empty line is shows along
>> with it. Similarly, a subtree is then defined to be before that empty
>> line. As I said, this is an undocumented feature in so far as the
>> corresponding variable is not customizable. However, you can still
>> set
>> it in the old way using
>>
>> (setq outline-blank-line t)
>>
>> If you do it in this way, there will be no difference between a single
>> or a double empty line. An empty line before a heading will create an
>> empty line in the CONTENT and CHILDREN views of org-cycle.
>>
>> 2. If we insist on your convention on using two line to mark a
>> separation (we should, because it is the better convention), you would
>> have to redefine a function in outline. This is not clean, but who
>> gives a s*** :-) And I like this convention better, because I very
>> often want to have an empty line above a headline without it meaning a
>> separation.
>>
>> The function to modify is outline-show-heading, and it must be
>> modified
>> after outline.el has been loaded. If you are only using outline in
>> connection with Org-mode, here is a way to do this:
>>
>> (add-hook 'org-load-hook
>> (lambda ()
>> (defun outline-show-heading ()
>> "Show the current heading and move to its end."
>> (outline-flag-region
>> (- (point)
>> (cond
>> ((bobp) 0)
>> ((equal (buffer-substring
>> (max (point-min) (- (point) 3)) (point))
>> "\n\n\n")
>> 2)
>> (t 1)))
>> (progn (outline-end-of-heading) (point))
>> nil))))
>>
>> If you want this for other uses of outline as well, you could use
>> `eval-after-load' or defadvice to achieve this change.
>>
>> There is a small possibility that doing either of these things might
>> break something else in org-mode. I don't think so, but maybe I am
>> not
>> overseeing it fully. If you see something strange, let me know.
>>
>> Hope this helps.
>>
>> - Carsten
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Emacs-orgmode mailing list
>> Emacs-orgmode@gnu.org
>> http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/emacs-orgmode
>>
>
>
--
Carsten Dominik
Sterrenkundig Instituut "Anton Pannekoek"
Universiteit van Amsterdam
Kruislaan 403
NL-1098SJ Amsterdam
phone: +31 20 525 7477
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 3+ messages in thread
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[not found] <20060823131338.GA32711@zoidberg.homeip.net>
2006-08-24 6:28 ` Org-mode 'organized' visibility Carsten Dominik
2006-08-24 20:17 ` Eddward DeVilla
2006-08-25 7:01 ` Carsten Dominik
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