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From: Jean Louis <bugs@gnu.support>
To: arthur miller <arthur.miller@live.com>
Cc: Gregory Heytings <gregory@heytings.org>,
	Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi@gnus.org>,
	"emacs-devel@gnu.org" <emacs-devel@gnu.org>
Subject: Re: Sv: Suggested experimental test
Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2021 13:24:10 +0300	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <YFhwSZ3pjllubD2P@protected.localdomain> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <AM9PR09MB4977D8751026A7CA977AE11196669@AM9PR09MB4977.eurprd09.prod.outlook.com>

* arthur miller <arthur.miller@live.com> [2021-03-21 13:59]:
> I don't understand why people are so passionately wasting time
> on arguing about shortcuts. As I understand Emacs it is supposed
> to be molded after each ones preference. Personally to me I rebind
> almost anything to my liking and what makes sense to me.

To help you understand from my perspective, I am maintaining multiple
remote servers, and have multiple computers, and each time when
working on those computers I do not use any custom key bindings, and I
do some extensive, personally important editing. Some computers use
older Emacs versions, only one is using the development version, some
are on different free operating systems, currently we use 4 different
operating systems. I do expect Emacs to behave by how we used to know
it by habit.

Being passionate is virtue and benefit for Emacs development. I cannot
see it as a waste of time as by following last months or years of
development I can just see great improvements without which I would
not be able to do my work right now. It is easy, after all
discussions, to then say how some of emails were waste of time, but
that falls into the context of saying that it is easy to be general
after the battle. Discussions bring about good things, and they create
new software and incite people to create new software.

Many disagreements may bring some programmers to make new useful
software, we can see that in case of ergonomical key bindings in the
package `ergoemacs-mode' of Xah, we can see that disagreements come up
with new excellent Emacs extensions like Spacemacs or Doom Emacs, that
people like so much.

Emacs may be customizes as one wish, but there are expectations by
Emacs users that can annoy and break the habits. That is price. If the
price is affordable, then changing some key bindings like M-o is quite
alright as for now.

If we however start changing key bindings like it is some kind of a
priority, we will see decline of Emacs users as some may find it
silly. Human editors tend to learn methods and rely on its software.



  parent reply	other threads:[~2021-03-22 10:24 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 154+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2021-03-20  9:03 Suggested experimental test Gregory Heytings
2021-03-20 11:14 ` Jean Louis
2021-03-20 11:27   ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-20 11:34   ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-20 12:37 ` Proposal to remove C-o binding [was: Suggested experimental test] Alan Mackenzie
2021-03-21  6:53 ` Suggested experimental test Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-21  8:35   ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-21 13:20     ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-21 18:16       ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-21 22:16         ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-21 22:54           ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-21 23:05             ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-21 23:13               ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-21 23:46                 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-22  0:40                   ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-22 10:05                     ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-22 18:14                       ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-22 19:06                         ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-22 19:56                           ` [External] : " Drew Adams
2021-03-22 21:03                             ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-22 21:26                               ` Drew Adams
2021-03-23  8:06                                 ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-22 21:08                           ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-22 11:21                   ` Jean Louis
2021-03-22 11:07               ` Jean Louis
2021-03-22  3:33           ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-22 10:05             ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-22 11:37               ` Philip Kaludercic
2021-03-22 12:20                 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-22 17:38               ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-22 17:48                 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-22 18:11                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-22 18:15                   ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-22 18:14               ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-22  8:59           ` Rudolf Schlatte
2021-03-22 10:05             ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-22 10:49           ` Jean Louis
2021-03-21 10:48   ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-21 10:58     ` Sv: " arthur miller
2021-03-21 13:20       ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-21 18:16       ` Sv: " Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-22  5:11         ` Richard Stallman
2021-03-22 10:24       ` Jean Louis [this message]
2021-03-22 10:14     ` Jean Louis
2021-03-22 12:06     ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-22 12:23       ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-22 16:15         ` Jean Louis
2021-03-22 16:14       ` Jean Louis
2021-03-22 17:08         ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-22 17:46           ` Alan Mackenzie
2021-03-22 17:59             ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-22 18:23             ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-23  6:09             ` Richard Stallman
2021-03-22 18:03           ` Jean Louis
2021-03-22 17:20       ` Robin Tarsiger
2021-03-22 17:40       ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-22 17:55         ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-22 18:13           ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-22 20:22             ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-23  8:06               ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-23 14:15                 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-23 14:37                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-23 16:51                     ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-23 17:13                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-23 18:08                       ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-23 21:06                         ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-23 21:43                           ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-23 21:57                             ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-23 22:08                               ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-23 22:14                                 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-23 22:42                                   ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-23 23:05                                     ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-24  5:15                                 ` Richard Stallman
2021-03-24  5:16                           ` Richard Stallman
2021-03-24  6:39                           ` Jean Louis
2021-03-24  6:32                       ` Jean Louis
2021-03-24  6:10                   ` Jean Louis
2021-03-22 18:17         ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-22 18:50           ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-22 19:09             ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-22 19:55               ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-22 22:02                 ` Stefan Kangas
2021-03-22 22:33                   ` [External] : " Drew Adams
2021-03-22 23:28                     ` Stefan Kangas
2021-03-22 22:44                   ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-03-22 23:22                     ` Stefan Kangas
2021-03-23  5:22                     ` Jean Louis
2021-03-23  7:43                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-23 12:28                         ` Philip Kaludercic
2021-03-23 12:41                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-23 13:09                             ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-03-23 13:27                               ` Philip Kaludercic
2021-03-23 14:00                                 ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-03-23 13:54                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-23 17:04                                 ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-03-23 21:06                                 ` chad
2021-03-24  5:07                             ` Jean Louis
2021-03-25  5:09                               ` Richard Stallman
2021-03-23  6:12                     ` Yuri Khan
2021-03-24 23:41                       ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-03-25  6:12                         ` Yuri Khan
2021-03-25 13:20                           ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-03-25 14:30                             ` Basil L. Contovounesios
2021-03-25 17:09                               ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-03-25 18:59                               ` Yuri Khan
2021-03-25 19:30                             ` Yuri Khan
2021-03-25 21:11                               ` Stefan Monnier
2021-03-25 23:54                                 ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-03-26 10:34                                   ` Stefan Kangas
2021-03-26 23:13                                     ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-03-26 23:34                               ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-03-27  0:02                                 ` Stefan Monnier
2021-03-28 13:59                                   ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-03-22 20:22               ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-22 20:36                 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-22 21:03                   ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-22 20:56         ` Thierry Volpiatto
2021-03-22 18:11       ` [EXTERNAL] " Stephan Mueller
2021-03-22 18:34         ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-22 18:56           ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-22 19:13             ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-22 19:19               ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-22 19:25                 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-22 19:49                   ` Stefan Monnier
2021-03-22 19:52                     ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-22 20:54                       ` Stefan Monnier
2021-03-22 21:04                         ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-23  7:18                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-22 19:21               ` chad
2021-03-22 19:26                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-22 19:51                   ` Stefan Monnier
2021-03-22 20:04                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-22 20:11                       ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-22 20:16                         ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-23  7:04                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-22 20:49                       ` Stefan Monnier
2021-03-22 21:02                         ` [External] : " Drew Adams
2021-03-23  7:09                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-22 19:28                 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-03-22 19:56                   ` [External] : " Drew Adams
2021-03-22 20:56                     ` Stefan Monnier
2021-03-22 21:19                       ` Drew Adams
2021-03-22 20:22             ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-23  8:09               ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-23 14:15                 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-03-23 14:31                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-03-23 17:21                   ` Bob Rogers
2021-03-24  5:42                   ` Jean Louis
2021-03-23 20:55                 ` chad
2021-03-25 17:04           ` [EXTERNAL] " Stephan Mueller
2021-03-22 19:37         ` Stefan Monnier
2021-03-22 19:42         ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-03-22 20:33       ` Jose A. Ortega Ruiz
2021-03-22 18:42     ` Sean Whitton

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