From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Arthur Miller Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Friendlier dired experience [CODE INCLUDED] Date: Thu, 05 Nov 2020 09:05:44 +0100 Message-ID: References: <20201103104340.q34kqfita55w2u7h@E15-2016.optimum.net> <20201104183228.xf7w4yf3fw3427y5@E15-2016.optimum.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="24403"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) Cc: Boruch Baum , Emacs-Devel List To: Stefan Monnier Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Thu Nov 05 09:23:08 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1kaaXz-0006Fw-SE for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; 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envelope-from=arthur.miller@live.com; helo=EUR04-VI1-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: First seen = 2020/11/05 03:20:53 X-ACL-Warn: Detected OS = Windows NT kernel [generic] [fuzzy] X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, MSGID_FROM_MTA_HEADER=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:258711 Archived-At: Stefan Monnier writes: >>> How 'bout we add it to GNU ELPA and then we work on integrating some of >>> the code into Dired >> I'm fine with integrating parts of it into dired, but I wouldn't want it >> done in a way that breaks the stand-alone package. In other words, the >> feature super-set (updated) copy from the github upstream should always >> continue to work. > > Of course. This said, in many/most cases, integration requires changes > which end up having some impact on the actual user-visible > functionality. Whether they're considered as "breaking" or not is often > a question of point of view. > >>> (i.e. the part that makes sense within Dired itself)? >> What part do you have in mind? > > I don't have any in mind: I use neither Dired nor anything like > midnight-commander (I do my file-management with zsh, and I don't even > do that within Emacs), so I'm not the best person to make such calls. > > But clearly, some parts of diredc.el don't make sense within Dired > because they're specific to the dual-pane setup, whereas Dired is > a single-buffer mode, meant to be independent from window layout. > > > Stefan I use Emacs for almost all interaction with the computer, and I do manage my files with Helm + Dired, so I am always interested to see something new. I have skimmed through diredc (readme + code) but I haven't tried it. As far as I see, the only part I see worth putting directly in dired is maybe as you pointed out trash management. I don't use Sunrise nor any other `comander' Ranger clone; it is just not needed. I don't use trash folder either for that matter, but I can see there is not much of trash handling offered via Emacs, so maybe some users would prefer to have such functionality. Unfortunately for some features, as I read the diredc code; I would probably be annoyed if they were in dired. Particularly if dired asked yes/no if I really wish to bookmark a place and if I wish to start diredc. If user bothered to press a 4-letter combination, then I think we can be sure the user wish to create that bookmark; it is really unnecessary to ask if I am really sure :-). Just my opinion. Extra colours for chmod: we have it already in Dired+, it looks like a rainbow, really not very user friendly to give them each different colour (sorry Drew). History handling: can it not be handled by recentf/winner modes already? I am not particulary against custom history handling, but recentf already does it and winner has undo/redo stack maybe they can be reused? Ther is a thing I would like to have in Dired, but I haven't got time myself to look at it: utilisation of new Tab thing. Since tabs seem to act more like workspaces I would like to see them serialized and bookmarked so we could use them with Dired. However diredc seems to do it's own thing instead of reusing the functionality of tabs. Other functionality I would like to see is some from dired-hacks: toggle and filters. For me Helm does the most; dired is needed just sometimes, so it is nice if we can keep it lightweight. That said it does not mean that Emacs (or Elpa) can't include a file manager, I would just prefer to keep it separate from Dired. Just my opinion as a daily user of Emacs for file managment. I hope that Boruch does not take it as personal critique, I don't mean it as such. These are just my subjective opinions, so take them as such. It is nice you experiment and play with Dired and file management. Best regards /a