From: Drew Adams <drew.adams@oracle.com>
To: "João Távora" <joaotavora@gmail.com>,
"Gregory Heytings" <gregory@heytings.org>
Cc: "Richard Stallman" <rms@gnu.org>,
"Phil Sainty" <psainty@orcon.net.nz>,
emacs-devel <emacs-devel@gnu.org>,
"André A. Gomes" <andremegafone@gmail.com>,
"Michael Heerdegen" <michael_heerdegen@web.de>,
"Lars Ingebrigtsen" <larsi@gnus.org>
Subject: RE: [External] : Re: Do shorthands break basic tooling (tags, grep, etc)? (was Re: Shorthands have landed on master)
Date: Thu, 30 Sep 2021 16:23:24 +0000 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <SJ0PR10MB5488B6E2A4E7BD643007AB7AF3AA9@SJ0PR10MB5488.namprd10.prod.outlook.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <CALDnm53SVhQWY3vHgXLwgxkHTzEsmfghU_bWRuRxG5uk2nqroA@mail.gmail.com>
> Tools that understand the symbolic nature of the Lisp
> family of languages. For the example you have since,
> Tools that rely on way or the other really on the
> 'read' Lisp primitive.
https://github.com/emacsmirror/el-search
(Not sure that's the latest or best or only location.
Ccing Michael H.)
___
As for grep etc. _versus_ Lisp-aware searching:
Both Lisp-aware and ad-hoc searches (searching for
_anything_ in any kind of code or text, including
Lisp code) are useful. It's not either/or.
As for the proposal: I do hope Phil S's points get
addressed thoughtfully.
> Grep, as you very well note, is already flawed,
> not only for Lisp, but for many languages.
> By "flawed" I mean: it is not suitable for
> categorically answering questions e.g. about how
> functions relate to each other (callers and
> callees).
Of course. Regexps are limited. `grep' is
limited. It's only "flawed" if you expect it to
be something it's not. Such tools, and regexp
search in particular, are handy and useful, even
though they have limitations. Even if you use
regexp search to do nothing more than substring
searching, it's useful.
Some use regexps for things they're awful for
(useless or worse than useless).
Some other people go beyond usefully pointing
out the limitations of regexps to crusade
against using regexps. Both are misguided, IMO.
A hammer is a useful tool; it's just not the
only tool, and for many jobs it's not the best
tool. Howling against hammers is, well, as
dumb as thinking they're useful for everything.
/s/hammer/duct tape, if you like. ;-)
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2021-09-30 16:23 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 371+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2021-09-28 0:38 Do shorthands break basic tooling (tags, grep, etc)? (was Re: Shorthands have landed on master) Phil Sainty
2021-09-28 5:43 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-09-28 7:26 ` João Távora
2021-09-30 6:03 ` Richard Stallman
2021-09-30 8:20 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-09-30 10:31 ` André A. Gomes
2021-09-30 10:54 ` Alan Mackenzie
2021-09-30 11:18 ` João Távora
2021-09-30 11:40 ` André A. Gomes
2021-09-30 16:58 ` Alan Mackenzie
2021-09-30 20:25 ` João Távora
2021-10-01 3:01 ` Stefan Monnier
2021-09-30 11:30 ` André A. Gomes
2021-09-30 17:37 ` Alan Mackenzie
2021-09-30 11:46 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-09-30 12:41 ` João Távora
2021-09-30 13:00 ` Tomas Hlavaty
2021-09-30 13:26 ` João Távora
2021-09-30 14:26 ` Tomas Hlavaty
2021-09-30 14:57 ` João Távora
2021-09-30 15:50 ` Tomas Hlavaty
2021-09-30 16:02 ` João Távora
2021-09-30 17:58 ` Tomas Hlavaty
2021-09-30 23:30 ` João Távora
2021-10-04 15:29 ` André A. Gomes
2021-09-30 13:18 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-09-30 13:31 ` João Távora
2021-09-30 13:41 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-09-30 16:23 ` Drew Adams [this message]
2021-09-30 17:19 ` [External] : " João Távora
2021-10-01 1:20 ` Michael Heerdegen
2021-09-30 22:10 ` Michael Heerdegen
2021-09-30 22:22 ` A read-based grep-like for symbols (el-search?) (was Do shorthands break basic tooling (tags, grep, etc)? (was Re: Shorthands have landed on master)) João Távora
2021-09-30 23:23 ` Michael Heerdegen
2021-09-30 23:38 ` João Távora
2021-10-01 1:17 ` Michael Heerdegen
2021-10-01 7:02 ` tomas
2021-10-01 13:15 ` João Távora
2021-10-01 13:53 ` tomas
2021-10-01 14:30 ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-10-01 14:40 ` João Távora
2021-10-01 15:48 ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-10-01 16:05 ` João Távora
2021-10-01 16:11 ` João Távora
2021-10-01 16:41 ` João Távora
2021-10-01 23:17 ` Michael Heerdegen
2021-10-02 1:14 ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-10-02 1:46 ` João Távora
2021-10-02 2:13 ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-10-04 15:57 ` André A. Gomes
2021-10-02 1:05 ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-10-02 1:30 ` João Távora
2021-10-02 1:43 ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-10-02 2:05 ` João Távora
2021-10-02 2:24 ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-10-02 8:39 ` Adam Porter
2021-10-02 8:36 ` Adam Porter
2021-10-02 12:16 ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-10-02 23:18 ` Richard Stallman
2021-10-03 21:17 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-10-07 22:21 ` Richard Stallman
2021-10-18 21:13 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-10-18 21:22 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-10-20 6:45 ` Richard Stallman
2021-10-20 8:00 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-10-23 23:26 ` Richard Stallman
2021-10-01 22:58 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-10-01 23:03 ` João Távora
2021-10-02 8:50 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-10-02 10:29 ` João Távora
2021-10-02 11:57 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-10-02 12:44 ` João Távora
2021-10-02 14:50 ` João Távora
2021-10-02 15:01 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-10-02 15:22 ` Stefan Kangas
2021-10-02 15:33 ` But then what are namespaces ? (was: A read-based grep-like for symbols (el-search?) (was Do shorthands break basic tooling (tags, grep, etc)? (was Re: Shorthands have landed on master))) João Távora
2021-10-02 19:42 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-10-02 19:59 ` But then what are namespaces ? Stefan Monnier
2021-10-02 20:41 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-10-02 21:05 ` Stefan Monnier
2021-10-02 21:09 ` João Távora
2021-10-02 21:14 ` Stefan Monnier
2021-10-02 22:41 ` João Távora
2021-10-02 22:49 ` João Távora
2021-10-02 23:31 ` Stefan Monnier
2021-10-03 21:47 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-10-02 20:00 ` But then what are namespaces ? (was: A read-based grep-like for symbols (el-search?) (was Do shorthands break basic tooling (tags, grep, etc)? (was Re: Shorthands have landed on master))) João Távora
2021-10-02 20:41 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-10-02 20:46 ` João Távora
2021-10-03 1:15 ` [External] : " Drew Adams
2021-10-02 15:25 ` A read-based grep-like for symbols (el-search?) (was Do shorthands break basic tooling (tags, grep, etc)? (was Re: Shorthands have landed on master)) João Távora
2021-10-02 16:08 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-10-01 22:58 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-10-01 23:10 ` João Távora
2021-10-02 9:03 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-10-02 10:25 ` João Távora
2021-10-01 23:04 ` Michael Heerdegen
2021-09-30 12:34 ` Do shorthands break basic tooling (tags, grep, etc)? (was Re: Shorthands have landed on master) Tomas Hlavaty
2021-09-28 6:25 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-09-28 7:41 ` João Távora
2021-09-28 8:04 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-09-28 8:07 ` Helmut Eller
2021-10-02 1:06 ` João Távora
2021-09-28 12:40 ` Stefan Monnier
2021-09-28 15:28 ` João Távora
2021-09-28 19:21 ` Stefan Monnier
2021-09-28 17:25 ` Alan Mackenzie
2021-09-28 18:25 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-09-28 19:05 ` Alan Mackenzie
2021-09-28 19:29 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-09-30 12:23 ` Phil Sainty
2021-09-30 12:28 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-09-30 12:29 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-09-30 12:44 ` Joost Kremers
2021-09-30 13:18 ` Adam Porter
2021-10-01 0:11 ` Stefan Kangas
2021-09-30 12:52 ` Tomas Hlavaty
2021-09-30 12:55 ` João Távora
2021-09-30 13:49 ` Tomas Hlavaty
2021-09-30 13:17 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-01 0:21 ` João Távora
2021-09-30 14:12 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-09-30 14:27 ` João Távora
2021-09-30 22:50 ` Phil Sainty
2021-10-01 0:44 ` Stefan Kangas
2021-10-01 7:06 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-10-01 7:24 ` João Távora
2021-10-01 10:10 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-01 6:09 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-01 12:24 ` Phil Sainty
2021-10-01 13:00 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-02 0:28 ` Phil Sainty
2021-10-02 6:45 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-02 7:44 ` Phil Sainty
2021-10-02 8:53 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-02 9:20 ` bug#50959: 28.0.50; Shorthand symbols are unknown to Emacs Phil Sainty
2021-10-02 10:15 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-02 11:02 ` João Távora
2021-10-02 11:09 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-02 11:14 ` João Távora
2021-10-02 11:54 ` João Távora
2021-10-02 12:29 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-02 14:02 ` João Távora
2021-10-02 14:20 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-02 14:43 ` João Távora
2021-10-02 14:56 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-02 15:22 ` João Távora
2021-10-02 15:53 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-02 17:46 ` João Távora
2021-10-02 17:58 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-02 18:03 ` João Távora
2021-10-02 18:28 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-04 0:14 ` Richard Stallman
2021-10-04 0:14 ` Richard Stallman
2021-10-04 0:14 ` Richard Stallman
2021-10-04 11:55 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-06 10:45 ` bug#50959: [PATCH] " João Távora
2021-10-06 12:19 ` Stefan Monnier via Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors
2021-10-06 12:34 ` João Távora
2021-10-06 12:50 ` Stefan Monnier via Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors
2021-10-06 12:53 ` João Távora
2021-10-06 19:59 ` Stefan Monnier via Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors
2021-10-06 20:19 ` João Távora
2021-10-10 10:46 ` João Távora
2021-10-10 11:08 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-10 13:39 ` João Távora
2021-10-10 14:23 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-04 0:14 ` Richard Stallman
2021-10-02 11:53 ` Phil Sainty
2021-10-02 12:10 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-02 12:37 ` Phil Sainty
2021-10-02 14:17 ` João Távora
2021-10-02 10:52 ` Do shorthands break basic tooling (tags, grep, etc)? (was Re: Shorthands have landed on master) João Távora
2021-10-04 0:12 ` Richard Stallman
2021-10-04 0:16 ` Richard Stallman
2021-10-04 13:09 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-10-04 15:44 ` João Távora
2021-10-04 16:51 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-04 17:43 ` João Távora
2021-10-04 17:51 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-04 18:34 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-10-04 19:15 ` João Távora
2021-10-04 19:30 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-10-05 21:20 ` Richard Stallman
2021-10-06 13:12 ` João Távora
2021-10-05 21:20 ` Richard Stallman
2021-10-05 21:20 ` Richard Stallman
2021-10-05 22:07 ` João Távora
2021-10-05 22:15 ` Stefan Monnier
2021-10-06 11:28 ` João Távora
2021-10-06 12:21 ` Stefan Monnier
2021-10-06 12:30 ` João Távora
2021-10-06 12:46 ` Stefan Monnier
2021-10-06 13:16 ` João Távora
2021-10-06 16:23 ` João Távora
2021-10-06 20:00 ` Stefan Monnier
2021-10-06 21:10 ` João Távora
2021-10-06 21:39 ` Stefan Monnier
2021-10-10 21:09 ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-10-07 22:21 ` Richard Stallman
2021-10-07 22:24 ` João Távora
2021-10-08 6:08 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-08 12:58 ` Stefan Monnier
2021-10-08 13:22 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-10 21:06 ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-10-10 21:18 ` João Távora
2021-10-08 14:16 ` João Távora
2021-10-08 15:55 ` Stefan Monnier
2021-10-08 17:34 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-08 18:16 ` Stefan Monnier
2021-10-08 18:51 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-08 23:43 ` João Távora
2021-10-01 22:38 ` Richard Stallman
2021-10-01 22:41 ` João Távora
2021-10-01 22:52 ` João Távora
2021-10-01 23:52 ` Phil Sainty
2021-10-02 1:38 ` T.V Raman
2021-09-28 19:30 ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-09-28 18:38 ` Stefan Monnier
2021-09-28 19:14 ` Alan Mackenzie
2021-09-28 19:22 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-09-28 19:31 ` Alan Mackenzie
2021-09-28 19:41 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-09-30 22:10 ` Richard Stallman
2021-09-30 23:59 ` Tomas Hlavaty
2021-09-28 7:21 ` João Távora
2021-09-28 12:49 ` Phil Sainty
2021-09-28 13:08 ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-09-28 14:04 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-09-28 15:01 ` Adam Porter
2021-09-28 15:20 ` João Távora
2021-09-28 19:23 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-09-28 15:15 ` João Távora
2021-09-30 6:06 ` Richard Stallman
2021-10-05 5:57 ` Elisp LSP Server Ag Ibragimov
2021-10-05 6:38 ` Po Lu
2021-10-05 9:50 ` Philip Kaludercic
2021-10-05 11:27 ` Po Lu
2021-10-05 11:46 ` Philip Kaludercic
2021-10-06 20:57 ` Richard Stallman
2021-10-06 21:22 ` Philip Kaludercic
2021-10-06 21:44 ` Stefan Monnier
2021-10-07 22:27 ` Richard Stallman
2021-10-07 0:49 ` Po Lu
2021-10-10 12:48 ` Ag Ibragimov
2021-10-10 14:19 ` Daniel Martín
2021-10-10 16:49 ` Philip Kaludercic
2021-10-10 19:25 ` Daniel Martín
2021-10-11 7:44 ` Po Lu
2021-10-11 21:15 ` Richard Stallman
2021-10-12 5:29 ` Ag Ibragimov
2021-10-12 5:48 ` Po Lu
2021-10-12 17:14 ` Ag Ibragimov
2021-10-12 17:46 ` Stefan Kangas
2021-10-12 20:53 ` dick
2021-10-13 2:29 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-13 11:56 ` dick
2021-10-13 13:19 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-13 4:47 ` Ag Ibragimov
2021-10-13 0:02 ` Po Lu
2021-10-27 14:36 ` Richard Stallman
2021-10-27 18:04 ` dick
2021-10-27 18:27 ` tomas
2021-10-27 18:33 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-27 18:55 ` Karl Fogel
2021-10-27 19:15 ` dick
2021-10-12 7:14 ` tomas
2021-10-12 8:04 ` Ag Ibragimov
2021-10-12 22:43 ` Richard Stallman
2021-10-13 5:36 ` Ag Ibragimov
2021-10-13 22:40 ` Richard Stallman
2021-10-12 22:43 ` Richard Stallman
2021-10-13 3:42 ` Ag Ibragimov
2021-10-13 5:20 ` Po Lu
2021-10-13 12:39 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-13 12:49 ` Po Lu
2021-10-13 13:25 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-13 13:37 ` Po Lu
2021-10-13 13:53 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-13 23:42 ` Po Lu
2021-10-13 13:38 ` Philip Kaludercic
2021-10-14 22:22 ` Richard Stallman
2021-10-14 22:26 ` Richard Stallman
2021-10-15 6:35 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-15 9:54 ` Tim Cross
2021-10-10 23:45 ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-10-11 7:34 ` Po Lu
2021-10-11 9:10 ` Alexandre Garreau
2021-10-11 10:46 ` Po Lu
2021-10-11 10:48 ` Alexandre Garreau
2021-10-11 21:16 ` Richard Stallman
2021-10-12 7:17 ` tomas
2021-10-14 12:48 ` Alexandre Garreau
2021-10-15 22:47 ` Richard Stallman
2021-10-11 21:10 ` Richard Stallman
2021-10-22 16:23 ` Mathias Dahl
2021-10-22 16:40 ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-10-22 16:45 ` Alexandre Garreau
2021-10-22 19:59 ` Tim Cross
2021-10-22 21:09 ` Stefan Kangas
2021-10-22 21:58 ` Tim Cross
2021-10-22 22:27 ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-10-22 22:48 ` Tim Cross
2021-10-22 23:11 ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-10-23 23:27 ` Richard Stallman
2021-10-25 7:47 ` Alexandre Garreau
2021-10-23 2:00 ` Po Lu
2021-10-25 2:17 ` Richard Stallman
2021-10-25 7:00 ` Alexandre Garreau
2021-10-22 16:55 ` Mathias Dahl
2021-10-22 20:55 ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-10-25 2:17 ` Richard Stallman
2021-10-25 7:22 ` Alexandre Garreau
2021-10-25 7:45 ` Theodor Thornhill
2021-10-25 7:51 ` Alexandre Garreau
2021-10-25 8:23 ` Theodor Thornhill
2021-10-30 6:51 ` Richard Stallman
2021-11-01 11:48 ` Alexandre Garreau
2021-11-01 17:47 ` Tim Cross
2021-11-03 3:18 ` Richard Stallman
2021-11-03 20:06 ` Jostein Kjønigsen
2021-11-05 3:53 ` Richard Stallman
2021-11-05 5:55 ` Daniel Brooks
2021-11-05 6:25 ` Jostein Kjønigsen
2021-11-05 9:56 ` Alexandre Garreau
2021-10-25 5:46 ` Jostein Kjønigsen
2021-10-06 20:57 ` Richard Stallman
2021-10-06 21:35 ` Philip Kaludercic
2021-10-05 10:15 ` Joost Kremers
2021-10-06 20:57 ` Richard Stallman
2021-10-12 2:52 ` Ag Ibragimov
2021-10-12 3:37 ` dick
2021-10-12 3:43 ` Stefan Kangas
2021-10-12 22:41 ` Richard Stallman
2021-10-12 4:08 ` Stefan Monnier
2021-10-12 5:55 ` Po Lu
2021-10-12 7:22 ` Ag Ibragimov
2021-10-12 10:21 ` Philip Kaludercic
2021-10-12 12:14 ` tomas
2021-10-12 12:51 ` Philip Kaludercic
2021-10-12 13:08 ` tomas
2021-10-12 12:22 ` Stefan Monnier
2021-10-12 22:41 ` Richard Stallman
2021-10-13 0:00 ` Po Lu
2021-10-13 0:22 ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-10-13 0:31 ` Tim Cross
2021-10-13 17:15 ` Joost Kremers
2021-10-13 17:34 ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-10-13 20:00 ` Tim Cross
2021-10-13 21:47 ` Stefan Monnier
2021-10-13 23:14 ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-10-14 6:39 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-14 6:58 ` Po Lu
2021-10-14 6:52 ` Po Lu
2021-10-14 11:08 ` dick
2021-10-14 13:34 ` Augusto Stoffel
2021-10-14 8:20 ` João Távora
2021-10-15 22:51 ` Richard Stallman
2021-10-16 19:02 ` João Távora
2021-10-17 23:49 ` Richard Stallman
2021-10-17 23:58 ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-10-20 22:33 ` Richard Stallman
2021-10-18 0:32 ` Tim Cross
2021-10-18 1:18 ` Stefan Monnier
2021-10-18 2:23 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-18 12:43 ` Stefan Monnier
2021-10-18 13:13 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-10-14 7:01 ` Po Lu
2021-10-14 8:43 ` [OT] Elisp as a general purpose programming language (was: Elisp LSP Server) Joost Kremers
2021-10-14 10:37 ` Jean-Christophe Helary
2021-10-14 7:03 ` Elisp LSP Server Po Lu
Reply instructions:
You may reply publicly to this message via plain-text email
using any one of the following methods:
* Save the following mbox file, import it into your mail client,
and reply-to-all from there: mbox
Avoid top-posting and favor interleaved quoting:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posting_style#Interleaved_style
* Reply using the --to, --cc, and --in-reply-to
switches of git-send-email(1):
git send-email \
--in-reply-to=SJ0PR10MB5488B6E2A4E7BD643007AB7AF3AA9@SJ0PR10MB5488.namprd10.prod.outlook.com \
--to=drew.adams@oracle.com \
--cc=andremegafone@gmail.com \
--cc=emacs-devel@gnu.org \
--cc=gregory@heytings.org \
--cc=joaotavora@gmail.com \
--cc=larsi@gnus.org \
--cc=michael_heerdegen@web.de \
--cc=psainty@orcon.net.nz \
--cc=rms@gnu.org \
/path/to/YOUR_REPLY
https://kernel.org/pub/software/scm/git/docs/git-send-email.html
* If your mail client supports setting the In-Reply-To header
via mailto: links, try the mailto: link
Be sure your reply has a Subject: header at the top and a blank line
before the message body.
Code repositories for project(s) associated with this external index
https://git.savannah.gnu.org/cgit/emacs.git
https://git.savannah.gnu.org/cgit/emacs/org-mode.git
This is an external index of several public inboxes,
see mirroring instructions on how to clone and mirror
all data and code used by this external index.