From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Drew Adams Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: RE: [External] : Re: Setting up abbrev Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2022 16:36:23 +0000 Message-ID: References: <87k07sfywz.fsf@dataswamp.org> <87tu6wchw5.fsf@dataswamp.org> <87zggoatct.fsf@dataswamp.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="21643"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" To: Emanuel Berg , "help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org" Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Mon Aug 01 18:51:13 2022 Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1oIYdM-0005UD-HI for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; 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envelope-from=drew.adams@oracle.com; helo=mx0a-00069f02.pphosted.com X-Spam_score_int: -27 X-Spam_score: -2.8 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.8 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "help-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.help:138725 Archived-At: > >> Only a pair is a list as well ... > > > > Yes. But a list isn't a pair. ;-) >=20 > Every pair is a list but every list isn't a pair ... | not every list is a pair "Not every X is" =3D "some X isn't" !=3D "every X isn't" > Well, maybe one can think of a pair without order, i.e. > a set of two items? >=20 > The _ordered_ pair is the universal data structure that can > express anything then. The list is equally universal but the > ordered pair is the minimal working example, to speak with the > LaTeX guys ... Yes, ordered pair. That's a cons. > > As for the (a . b) _notation_: Why not? JSON uses `:'. > > Prolog uses `|'. Doesn't matter much what notation you > > choose. OOPs often use a dot notation for method > > application. Six of one; half a dozen of another... >=20 > Okay, but I still don't understand the benefit of using it in > practice compared to the list (a b)? Do you mean use the _notation_? I guess you instead mean use a dotted list: a list whose last cdr is a non-nil atom. If so, the answer is that in general you do want to use a true/proper list (last cdr is nil), and NOT a dotted list. For many reasons, not least of which is using a function that needs to traverse all list elements (e.g. `length', mapping/sequence functions). You can use a dotted list in these cases: 1. You want to save conses (not create so many), in a context where you're not going to be needing to use the cons as a list (mapping etc.), or a context where you know you'll only ever want an atom cdr. 2. You want/need, in effect, to have a backwards key-value pair, (list-value . atom-key). You have a list to use for most purposes (ignoring the last cdr), and you have an atom (the cdr) for a few rare purposes, as a kind of label for the list. #2 is usually the result of trying to adapt to legacy code that expects to treat just a list (and doesn't need to follow it to its end). IOW, #2 is typically an ugly hack. For new code you'd instead just put the atom first: (atom-key . list-value).