From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Drew Adams Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#65348: INITIAL-INPUT in completing-read repeats same entry twice consecutively Date: Sat, 19 Aug 2023 16:20:07 +0000 Message-ID: References: <7D2p2XmGzWwhYjrI_PaUsn8r_NaQf-B0eAf7AmeRIhBEl84z79j_jKky-Lqlt6nc52SQ7T5yrL9OdqUzou1Mh3zQzgJx-SV6kIvc9Km8bDg=@protonmail.com> <20R1-cGUtXe8gGwpzmjNHlz39n0IhiK 5lKCn-K1ojbdvMs9R2svYlvbpbFZRqgNZ5i8IYFSO_nitMCNWsw3hg1Zef3DJSjdgZSn5qjXcp8g=@protonmail.com> <83a5un35h6.fsf@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="10779"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: "65348@debbugs.gnu.org" <65348@debbugs.gnu.org> To: Eli Zaretskii , Heime Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sat Aug 19 18:21:18 2023 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1qXOhR-0002Y1-Ns for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 19 Aug 2023 18:21:18 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1qXOhG-0004mf-5A; Sat, 19 Aug 2023 12:21:06 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1qXOhB-0004kI-E5 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 19 Aug 2023 12:21:01 -0400 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:5::43]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1qXOhB-0006RU-4b for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 19 Aug 2023 12:21:01 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1qXOhC-0003pZ-4c for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 19 Aug 2023 12:21:02 -0400 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Drew Adams Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Sat, 19 Aug 2023 16:21:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 65348 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: notabug Original-Received: via spool by 65348-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B65348.169246201814650 (code B ref 65348); Sat, 19 Aug 2023 16:21:02 +0000 Original-Received: (at 65348) by debbugs.gnu.org; 19 Aug 2023 16:20:18 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:52203 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1qXOgT-0003oE-JB for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 19 Aug 2023 12:20:17 -0400 Original-Received: from mx0b-00069f02.pphosted.com ([205.220.177.32]:48218) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1qXOgQ-0003nr-7G for 65348@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 19 Aug 2023 12:20:16 -0400 Original-Received: from pps.filterd (m0333520.ppops.net [127.0.0.1]) by mx0b-00069f02.pphosted.com (8.17.1.19/8.17.1.19) with ESMTP id 37JBCned018187; Sat, 19 Aug 2023 16:20:12 GMT DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=oracle.com; h=from : to : cc : subject : date : message-id : references : in-reply-to : content-type : content-transfer-encoding : mime-version; s=corp-2023-03-30; bh=MSqlPotKJLQtGO3k2kLQVlKh5s2wupJWeURQR1C4iNE=; b=s06dI4Jwb4XmD5yYirwDfpNhPr3R5kKVGF/QcD7iStBwO4jqWIjhreeJW4lR5l8DWH8O 9Zadh68Qx+y8UuJxiG3J9uyzo7HFUecFpI5zfAlJQwVqiFtGw1SgZ8dQzB6XjmsAabyl 1SwbO+5e5zXqOLAWZ7nmkvlXlHa3jlDOXYDTmOtmp2rgOzGQ521Qjlr4IhYxZW0DJ+X5 efFZJ9R1ZuZwAMUXk+0+SJEsWcaOtte6Tj0Bz+u9KHZLbk0w92KTxmQH3KeHrwjmtVts 3f+sr53Q0x0tTDamEQh5KZ29/nkldbF+Pfe0Cyu9m9+fizjihBYhoSjY234DWMI5AG0s +Q== Original-Received: from phxpaimrmta01.imrmtpd1.prodappphxaev1.oraclevcn.com (phxpaimrmta01.appoci.oracle.com [138.1.114.2]) by mx0b-00069f02.pphosted.com (PPS) with ESMTPS id 3sjnsc8jd9-1 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 19 Aug 2023 16:20:11 +0000 Original-Received: from pps.filterd (phxpaimrmta01.imrmtpd1.prodappphxaev1.oraclevcn.com [127.0.0.1]) by phxpaimrmta01.imrmtpd1.prodappphxaev1.oraclevcn.com (8.17.1.19/8.17.1.19) with ESMTP id 37JBc1k9030383; Sat, 19 Aug 2023 16:20:10 GMT Original-Received: from nam04-bn8-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-bn8nam04lp2046.outbound.protection.outlook.com [104.47.74.46]) by phxpaimrmta01.imrmtpd1.prodappphxaev1.oraclevcn.com (PPS) with ESMTPS id 3sjm61xgfx-1 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 19 Aug 2023 16:20:10 +0000 ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; s=arcselector9901; d=microsoft.com; cv=none; b=bjCTXW23LllIvPBC5puNbnOOwZBhx1x6hqoBVgtZAU5RTA0rOqqqa/F5cABPb8MgwWJP8aAtw1sBkWd+ueIgv7fMM3YHntNWPmUY6xpLfctGIJPNi5sFzGzY/vmuR132urmfgZ9VFEHqX9rPL3IhD5y0vS88tq1019f9nPkFxbo/wa3QBAG8MWiL7ZMK5AQwPcL/7UKXdVxLFHtBYyO7ncFHk9+jACs/Cu8WElCTfOGHX7SHDjBJmwfBjXtbJCPxVfHL8zyNL7RPYoiFICVZnvxWyfm1KMjWgVCgNS32NHch1nX2cDRY8+Iouc48PNx53oAuHZ1RF+zEL1jyicY/DQ== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=microsoft.com; s=arcselector9901; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-AntiSpam-MessageData-ChunkCount:X-MS-Exchange-AntiSpam-MessageData-0:X-MS-Exchange-AntiSpam-MessageData-1; bh=MSqlPotKJLQtGO3k2kLQVlKh5s2wupJWeURQR1C4iNE=; b=VFLWD/Xm9xHYjbUgZ0mQYCeK+DYj5M0YHwQ8ftb3tKUI0c6+oIjxXdvdTn86kCVXl8OVThYv3o2/FGn+ltE9VGDCnALBS0QoePVLN+A3hvS4Azo3iW+3owEGvNvq1aLA+WM5g1y4QFMtlncPtkBTQJH/tH1E06TabB1VE/vHVHHn52Y+f2bJmV4UYu6Nzzo6cDYZGei6xrpIvsh9fSfAMviP/zVijf3xO+hOyB3ANba0HM5Gy09XSz0kkpkYd8QBepQNk/YwEVHtHnMu02Mh06haSCFfjMpTt8FuqzAR23MjLvLH5GHfcUJXT7m6YHKFZDKhmbtELFTZWkuJjJ8kjw== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx.microsoft.com 1; spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=oracle.com; dmarc=pass action=none header.from=oracle.com; dkim=pass header.d=oracle.com; arc=none DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=oracle.onmicrosoft.com; s=selector2-oracle-onmicrosoft-com; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck; bh=MSqlPotKJLQtGO3k2kLQVlKh5s2wupJWeURQR1C4iNE=; b=ELdtIWbcn/lcTMEgxjCAEW/KCQViBhTWvNFL9O1rWvDIow1i1VySXjpdn22JGY/F2HP1sEc8iVYTQDWJyohnTAlxr1q3nsjGRzRM3G+k/Mpz7aiD62jG+CWM15Zb+MaKS2o2e05DYaOeGs0yeUP4hWCOZU59aALSrSguRnPydNo= Original-Received: from SJ0PR10MB5488.namprd10.prod.outlook.com (2603:10b6:a03:37e::19) by DS0PR10MB7522.namprd10.prod.outlook.com (2603:10b6:8:15e::16) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.6699.20; Sat, 19 Aug 2023 16:20:08 +0000 Original-Received: from SJ0PR10MB5488.namprd10.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::26ee:5721:d884:4321]) by SJ0PR10MB5488.namprd10.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::26ee:5721:d884:4321%5]) with mapi id 15.20.6699.020; Sat, 19 Aug 2023 16:20:07 +0000 Thread-Topic: [External] : Re: bug#65348: INITIAL-INPUT in completing-read repeats same entry twice consecutively Thread-Index: AQHZ0mc7KD7t82DCr0ihIwjIpmzs06/xx2Fg In-Reply-To: <83a5un35h6.fsf@gnu.org> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: SJ0PR10MB5488:EE_|DS0PR10MB7522:EE_ x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: fd6bfda1-bfcf-46f2-c784-08dba0d02710 x-ms-exchange-senderadcheck: 1 x-ms-exchange-antispam-relay: 0 x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0; x-microsoft-antispam-message-info: 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 x-forefront-antispam-report: CIP:255.255.255.255; CTRY:; LANG:en; SCL:1; SRV:; IPV:NLI; SFV:NSPM; H:SJ0PR10MB5488.namprd10.prod.outlook.com; PTR:; CAT:NONE; SFS:(13230031)(396003)(136003)(376002)(346002)(366004)(39860400002)(186009)(1800799009)(451199024)(66446008)(66476007)(64756008)(76116006)(66556008)(66946007)(316002)(9686003)(110136005)(8676002)(8936002)(4326008)(41300700001)(122000001)(478600001)(966005)(71200400001)(55016003)(38070700005)(7696005)(38100700002)(6506007)(2906002)(83380400001)(86362001)(44832011)(5660300002)(33656002)(26005)(52536014); DIR:OUT; SFP:1101; x-ms-exchange-antispam-messagedata-chunkcount: 1 x-ms-exchange-antispam-messagedata-0: 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 /FSW9adpfLHRZDrxQBNN6Vf5DClfEKQn9vKofT48dmmN0gphuyZENo3ZmSMrf6/E/aIDxoZiyYj8bWTdTAjEhiT8ZLEyIULCrQ X-MS-Exchange-AntiSpam-ExternalHop-MessageData-ChunkCount: 1 X-MS-Exchange-AntiSpam-ExternalHop-MessageData-0: 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 zXYA/7iv9598xxioFZOWJUPAyUvJF7oWFV02CDsgBhWcdGnOX2CX+uOUz5XWnfPGKR4g9Ty67ujYlKKiGu X-OriginatorOrg: oracle.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthAs: Internal X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthSource: SJ0PR10MB5488.namprd10.prod.outlook.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: fd6bfda1-bfcf-46f2-c784-08dba0d02710 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 19 Aug 2023 16:20:07.1825 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 4e2c6054-71cb-48f1-bd6c-3a9705aca71b X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-userprincipalname: NkY3MT+6Sk767GEUHw/0uShP9o/cv9CcKOPmhkd66yHIhdjab9MjqqgsuhgbTAFADJFiPWFkhQ43KB6FZJkuPg== X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: DS0PR10MB7522 X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=baseguard engine=ICAP:2.0.267,Aquarius:18.0.957,Hydra:6.0.601,FMLib:17.11.176.26 definitions=2023-08-19_18,2023-08-18_01,2023-05-22_02 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 suspectscore=0 mlxscore=0 spamscore=0 mlxlogscore=921 malwarescore=0 bulkscore=0 adultscore=0 phishscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2306200000 definitions=main-2308190157 X-Proofpoint-GUID: -DOOo6W9cjyhnVMbWJeK5hEn1I1cDOSV X-Proofpoint-ORIG-GUID: -DOOo6W9cjyhnVMbWJeK5hEn1I1cDOSV X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.bugs:267890 Archived-At: > You can try starting a discussion on emacs-devel if you want. But the > above-mentioned change was not done arbitrarily, and does have its > merit in many situations, I don't see that it has merit in any situation. I haven't seen a single example cited where it has merit. Can you point to one? I really don't see any value in this behavior. And I think you agreed that it's obvious that in some cases (such as the `C-h v' example cited in bug #64656) it's _clearly_ not helpful but harmful. > so be prepared for hearing people who think > they like the current situation and object to changing it. Drew's > opinion on this are not new, and have been heard (and rejected) > before. I searched but didn't see anywhere where my opinion on this was rejected. I think the relevant thread is that of bug #64656, which you intentionally kept open for this very question: whether COLLECTION should be automatically added to "future history". https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi/bugreport.cgi?bug=3D64656 Below are some relevant extracts from what I wrote there. The question I posed of what value this "feature" has was never answered. I'd like to hear about "its merit in many situations". You didn't point to any situations in that bug thread. Do you have any (let only "many") in mind? It's an honest question. I don't get the point of this feature. What am I missing? >From bug #64656: ___ But I'm asking about the general idea behind this default behavior: What use case(s) does it really help with? Even with a small list of (empty-input) completions, and even when those are in some meaningful/useful order, what's the use case for adding them to `M-n', which is a carefully designed default or list of defaults? Why use the completion domain as a set of defaults - at all? ___ 1. I'm asking whether this feature (addition of completion domain automatically) shouldn't be revisited, maybe even removed, and at least default to OFF. 2. If that revisit is NOT to be, then I'm asking that the doc at least (a) point out that this automatic behavior can be problematic, and (b) tell users how to (i) turn it off and (ii) control it a bit if not turned off. That control can include limiting the size and sorting the elements to be added. ___ ELI> If we think that future history in some case ELI> is useless, TRT is to change the code so ELI> that it ceases to be useless, 100% agreement. That's why that was my first priority request. Fix this and there likely will be no, or little, need to change the doc. I didn't assume that others would agree that the behavior is harmful. I thought too that I might just be missing something. The behavior seems so bizarre to me that I don't understand why it would have been adopted. Benefit of the doubt made me guess I'm maybe just misunderstanding. ___