* Looking for the "best" notation for key-binding
@ 2012-09-20 23:11 Chap Harrison
2012-09-21 0:30 ` John Wiegley
` (4 more replies)
0 siblings, 5 replies; 11+ messages in thread
From: Chap Harrison @ 2012-09-20 23:11 UTC (permalink / raw
To: help-gnu-emacs
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Here are examples of key bindings culled from the Emacs FAQ and
emacswiki. Each one seems to use a slightly different notation to
identify the keystroke.
(global-set-key (quote [f1]) (quote help-for-help))
(global-unset-key [?\e?{] )
(global-set-key [f10] [?\C-x?\e?\e?\C-a?\C-k?\C-g])
(global-unset-key "\e[" )
(global-set-key "\C-h" 'delete-backward-char)
(keyboard-translate ?\C-h ?\C-?)
(global-set-key (kbd "C-V") 'somefunction)
(global-set-key (kbd "<f3>") 'comment-dwim)
It's maddening. I've so far been unsuccessful in getting this binding
to work:
(global-set-key (kbd "C-;") 'comment-indent)
It seems to bind the command to the *unmodified* ';'.
Isn't there a single, simple, consistent way to create key bindings that
will always work?
Thanks,
Chap
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^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Re: Looking for the "best" notation for key-binding
2012-09-20 23:11 Looking for the "best" notation for key-binding Chap Harrison
@ 2012-09-21 0:30 ` John Wiegley
[not found] ` <mailman.9409.1348187445.855.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
` (3 subsequent siblings)
4 siblings, 0 replies; 11+ messages in thread
From: John Wiegley @ 2012-09-21 0:30 UTC (permalink / raw
To: help-gnu-emacs
>>>>> Chap Harrison <chap.harrison@me.com> writes:
> Isn't there a single, simple, consistent way to create key bindings that
> will always work?
I use this:
http://github.com/jwiegley/bind-key
Not only is it completely consistent, but it lets you M-x
describe-personal-keybindings and see what you've changed in your Emacs
environment.
John
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Re: Looking for the "best" notation for key-binding
[not found] ` <mailman.9409.1348187445.855.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
@ 2012-09-21 0:45 ` B. T. Raven
0 siblings, 0 replies; 11+ messages in thread
From: B. T. Raven @ 2012-09-21 0:45 UTC (permalink / raw
To: help-gnu-emacs
Die Thu Sep 20 2012 19:30:39 GMT-0500 (Central Daylight Time) John
Wiegley <johnw@newartisans.com> scripsit:
>>>>>> Chap Harrison <chap.harrison@me.com> writes:
>
>> Isn't there a single, simple, consistent way to create key bindings that
>> will always work?
>
> I use this:
>
> http://github.com/jwiegley/bind-key
>
> Not only is it completely consistent, but it lets you M-x
> describe-personal-keybindings and see what you've changed in your Emacs
> environment.
>
> John
>
Try:
(global-set-key [(control \;)] 'comment-indent)
Sorry, John. I first sent this only to you. Something new going on with
Mozilla Tbird.
Ed
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Re: Looking for the "best" notation for key-binding
2012-09-20 23:11 Looking for the "best" notation for key-binding Chap Harrison
2012-09-21 0:30 ` John Wiegley
[not found] ` <mailman.9409.1348187445.855.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
@ 2012-09-21 9:24 ` Peter Dyballa
2012-09-21 15:27 ` Chap Harrison
[not found] ` <mailman.9433.1348219496.855.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2012-10-01 14:31 ` Jambunathan K
4 siblings, 1 reply; 11+ messages in thread
From: Peter Dyballa @ 2012-09-21 9:24 UTC (permalink / raw
To: clh; +Cc: help-gnu-emacs
Am 21.09.2012 um 01:11 schrieb Chap Harrison:
> Isn't there a single, simple, consistent way to create key bindings that will always work?
I think the vector notation is a good choice:
(global-set-key [C-∫] 'backward-sexp) ; A-C-b
(global-set-key [M-S-return] 'other-window)
(global-set-key [f1 f5] 'apropos-variable)
(global-set-key [f3] 'compare-windows)
(global-set-key [A-f1] 'replace-string)
The commands you bind in your examples the keys are some macros (for f10 for example) or different syntax:
(quote help-for-help) = 'quote help-for-help
(quote [f1]) = [f1]
Entries in this syntax are usually created when using global-set-key interactively and saving the resulting bind commands.
Trying to bind the Lisp comment character ";" to anything can become tricky… In my Emacsen (23.4, 24.2.50) this works:
(global-set-key [67108923] 'comment-indent)
The number value can be found by typing, for example in *scratch* buffer, C-q C-;. This produces a record in the *Messages* buffer you can use.
--
Greetings
Pete
There's no sense in being precise when you don't even know what you're talking about.
– John von Neumann
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Re: Looking for the "best" notation for key-binding
[not found] ` <mailman.9433.1348219496.855.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
@ 2012-09-21 13:29 ` Stefan Monnier
2012-09-21 14:59 ` Peter Dyballa
0 siblings, 1 reply; 11+ messages in thread
From: Stefan Monnier @ 2012-09-21 13:29 UTC (permalink / raw
To: help-gnu-emacs
> I think the vector notation is a good choice:
> (global-set-key [C-∫] 'backward-sexp) ; A-C-b
This likely won't work. You need
(global-set-key [?\C-∫] 'backward-sexp) ; A-C-b
instead. Yes, it's an annoyance. You have to understand the
distinction between keys that emit characters and other keys (that emit
symbols).
> (global-set-key [M-S-return] 'other-window)
> (global-set-key [f1 f5] 'apropos-variable)
> (global-set-key [f3] 'compare-windows)
> (global-set-key [A-f1] 'replace-string)
These look just fine, yes.
> Trying to bind the Lisp comment character ";" to anything can become tricky…
> In my Emacsen (23.4, 24.2.50) this works:
> (global-set-key [67108923] 'comment-indent)
Now that's very intuitive. A better choice (maybe still not totally
obvious to come across, but at least a bit more obvious to understand
when you read it):
(global-set-key [?\C-\;] 'comment-indent)
> The number value can be found by typing, for example in *scratch* buffer,
> C-q C-;. This produces a record in the *Messages* buffer you can use.
If you type C-x C-e twice in a row, with point right after the magical
number, you'll see alternative ways to write this number, one of them
being the one I used above.
Stefan
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Re: Looking for the "best" notation for key-binding
2012-09-21 13:29 ` Stefan Monnier
@ 2012-09-21 14:59 ` Peter Dyballa
2012-09-21 16:29 ` Stefan Monnier
0 siblings, 1 reply; 11+ messages in thread
From: Peter Dyballa @ 2012-09-21 14:59 UTC (permalink / raw
To: Stefan Monnier; +Cc: help-gnu-emacs
Am 21.09.2012 um 15:29 schrieb Stefan Monnier:
>> I think the vector notation is a good choice:
>> (global-set-key [C-∫] 'backward-sexp) ; A-C-b
>
> This likely won't work. You need
>
> (global-set-key [?\C-∫] 'backward-sexp) ; A-C-b
>
> instead. Yes, it's an annoyance. You have to understand the
> distinction between keys that emit characters and other keys (that emit
> symbols).
Yes, it stopped working. A-b produces on my (Mac) keyboard ∫. So ∫ is a symbol just as © or Ω? What makes the distinction? Unicode character classes?
--
Greetings
Pete
When you meet a master swordsman,
show him your sword.
When you meet a man who is not a poet,
do not show him your poem.
– Rinzai, ninth century Zen master
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Re: Looking for the "best" notation for key-binding
2012-09-21 9:24 ` Peter Dyballa
@ 2012-09-21 15:27 ` Chap Harrison
2012-10-19 3:39 ` Kevin Rodgers
0 siblings, 1 reply; 11+ messages in thread
From: Chap Harrison @ 2012-09-21 15:27 UTC (permalink / raw
To: Peter Dyballa, help-gnu-emacs
On 09/21/2012 03:24 AM, Peter Dyballa wrote:
> Am 21.09.2012 um 01:11 schrieb Chap Harrison:
>
>> Isn't there a single, simple, consistent way to create key bindings that will always work?
> I think the vector notation is a good choice:
>
> (global-set-key [C-∫] 'backward-sexp) ; A-C-b
> (global-set-key [M-S-return] 'other-window)
> (global-set-key [f1 f5] 'apropos-variable)
> (global-set-key [f3] 'compare-windows)
> (global-set-key [A-f1] 'replace-string)
That looks and sounds straightforward enough.
I don't know elisp. Is there an exhaustive list of how to express all
of the key chords using vector notation? For instance, I wouldn't have
guessed that the 'return' key was denoted by 'return' - I usually see it
written RET.
As to my problem with C-; I strongly suspect my binding is getting
stomped by C++ mode. So I'd also appreciate some guidelines on what
keys to use or avoid.
Chap
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Re: Looking for the "best" notation for key-binding
2012-09-21 14:59 ` Peter Dyballa
@ 2012-09-21 16:29 ` Stefan Monnier
2012-09-21 20:37 ` Peter Dyballa
0 siblings, 1 reply; 11+ messages in thread
From: Stefan Monnier @ 2012-09-21 16:29 UTC (permalink / raw
To: Peter Dyballa; +Cc: help-gnu-emacs
>>> I think the vector notation is a good choice:
>>> (global-set-key [C-∫] 'backward-sexp) ; A-C-b
>> This likely won't work. You need
>> (global-set-key [?\C-∫] 'backward-sexp) ; A-C-b
>> instead. Yes, it's an annoyance. You have to understand the
>> distinction between keys that emit characters and other keys (that emit
>> symbols).
> Yes, it stopped working.
When did it work?
> So ∫ is a symbol just as © or Ω?
AFAIK they're all characters (my use of `symbol' was in the Lisp sense
of symbol as opposed to integer, string, cons, float, ...).
> What makes the distinction?
The code that turns GUI events into Lisp events, mostly. The general
rule is that keys which should self-insert get turned into
character-events, while other (special) keys get turned into symbol-events.
> Unicode character classes?
Unicode has nothing to do with it, no.
Stefan
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Re: Looking for the "best" notation for key-binding
2012-09-21 16:29 ` Stefan Monnier
@ 2012-09-21 20:37 ` Peter Dyballa
0 siblings, 0 replies; 11+ messages in thread
From: Peter Dyballa @ 2012-09-21 20:37 UTC (permalink / raw
To: Stefan Monnier; +Cc: help-gnu-emacs
Am 21.09.2012 um 18:29 schrieb Stefan Monnier:
>>>> I think the vector notation is a good choice:
>>>> (global-set-key [C-∫] 'backward-sexp) ; A-C-b
>>> This likely won't work. You need
>>> (global-set-key [?\C-∫] 'backward-sexp) ; A-C-b
>>> instead. Yes, it's an annoyance. You have to understand the
>>> distinction between keys that emit characters and other keys (that emit
>>> symbols).
>> Yes, it stopped working.
>
> When did it work?
I think it was in GNU Emacs 22 based "Carbon Emacs".
>
>> So ∫ is a symbol just as © or Ω?
>
> AFAIK they're all characters (my use of `symbol' was in the Lisp sense
> of symbol as opposed to integer, string, cons, float, ...).
>
>> What makes the distinction?
>
> The code that turns GUI events into Lisp events, mostly. The general
> rule is that keys which should self-insert get turned into
> character-events, while other (special) keys get turned into symbol-events.
∫ is a self-insert command:
∫ runs the command self-insert-command, which is an interactive
built-in function in `C source code'.
It is bound to many ordinary text characters.
--
Greetings
Pete
The wise man said: "Never argue with an idiot. They bring you down to their level and beat you with experience."
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Re: Looking for the "best" notation for key-binding
2012-09-20 23:11 Looking for the "best" notation for key-binding Chap Harrison
` (3 preceding siblings ...)
[not found] ` <mailman.9433.1348219496.855.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
@ 2012-10-01 14:31 ` Jambunathan K
4 siblings, 0 replies; 11+ messages in thread
From: Jambunathan K @ 2012-10-01 14:31 UTC (permalink / raw
To: clh; +Cc: help-gnu-emacs
Chap Harrison <chap.harrison@me.com> writes:
> Here are examples of key bindings culled from the Emacs FAQ and
> emacswiki. Each one seems to use a slightly different notation to
> identify the keystroke.
>
> (global-set-key (quote [f1]) (quote help-for-help))
> (global-unset-key [?\e?{] )
> (global-set-key [f10] [?\C-x?\e?\e?\C-a?\C-k?\C-g])
> (global-unset-key "\e[" )
> (global-set-key "\C-h" 'delete-backward-char)
> (keyboard-translate ?\C-h ?\C-?)
> (global-set-key (kbd "C-V") 'somefunction)
> (global-set-key (kbd "<f3>") 'comment-dwim)
>
> It's maddening. I've so far been unsuccessful in getting this binding
> to work:
>
> (global-set-key (kbd "C-;") 'comment-indent)
>
> It seems to bind the command to the *unmodified* ';'.
>
> Isn't there a single, simple, consistent way to create key bindings
> that will always work?
>
Use M-x global-set-key RET (or M-x local-set-key RET) and follow the
prompt.
Then M-x list-command-history. You will see the required elisp.
Here is what I get:
,----
| (global-set-key [67108923] (quote comment-indent))
`----
Will above representation work across different platforms or different
invocations of Emacs (terminal/gui/remote). I don't know and I would
like to know.
I can assure you that it will get the job done.
Likewise for local-set-key.
That said, in the long-run, it is better to not meddle with
Emacs-provided bindings.
> Thanks,
> Chap
>
>
--
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Re: Looking for the "best" notation for key-binding
2012-09-21 15:27 ` Chap Harrison
@ 2012-10-19 3:39 ` Kevin Rodgers
0 siblings, 0 replies; 11+ messages in thread
From: Kevin Rodgers @ 2012-10-19 3:39 UTC (permalink / raw
To: help-gnu-emacs
On 9/21/12 9:27 AM, Chap Harrison wrote:
> I don't know elisp. Is there an exhaustive list of how to express all of the key
> chords using vector notation? For instance, I wouldn't have guessed that the
> 'return' key was denoted by 'return' - I usually see it written RET.
They are different, see the "(emacs)Named ASCII Chars" info node.
> As to my problem with C-; I strongly suspect my binding is getting stomped by
> C++ mode. So I'd also appreciate some guidelines on what keys to use or avoid.
See the "(elisp)Key Binding Conventions" info node.
--
Kevin Rodgers
Denver, Colorado, USA
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
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-- links below jump to the message on this page --
2012-09-20 23:11 Looking for the "best" notation for key-binding Chap Harrison
2012-09-21 0:30 ` John Wiegley
[not found] ` <mailman.9409.1348187445.855.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2012-09-21 0:45 ` B. T. Raven
2012-09-21 9:24 ` Peter Dyballa
2012-09-21 15:27 ` Chap Harrison
2012-10-19 3:39 ` Kevin Rodgers
[not found] ` <mailman.9433.1348219496.855.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2012-09-21 13:29 ` Stefan Monnier
2012-09-21 14:59 ` Peter Dyballa
2012-09-21 16:29 ` Stefan Monnier
2012-09-21 20:37 ` Peter Dyballa
2012-10-01 14:31 ` Jambunathan K
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