From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: "Alfred M. Szmidt" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Shrinking the C core Date: Sun, 20 Aug 2023 12:29:31 -0400 Message-ID: References: <20230809094655.793FC18A4654@snark.thyrsus.com> <87fs4pkkqi.fsf@dataswamp.org> <87jztzkgct.fsf@dataswamp.org> <87y1if8j8t.fsf@linux-m68k.org> <87y1ifi9fv.fsf@dataswamp.org> <87zg2uqdmv.fsf@localhost> <87edk3gbh3.fsf@dataswamp.org> <87jztvnuyb.fsf@localhost> <875y5bdutt.fsf@dataswamp.org> <87y1i6e1uh.fsf@localhost> <874jkub40o.fsf@dataswamp.org> <87jztqdw2l.fsf@localhost> <87msym9i4r.fsf@dataswamp.org> <877cpp914t.fsf@localhost> <83fs4dwwdo.fsf@gnu.org> <874jkt90a5.fsf@localhost> Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="6882"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: eliz@gnu.org, incal@dataswamp.org, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Ihor Radchenko Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sun Aug 20 18:30:23 2023 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1qXlJn-0001c4-AE for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 20 Aug 2023 18:30:23 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1qXlJ0-0002M9-K1; Sun, 20 Aug 2023 12:29:34 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1qXlIz-0002Lz-1X for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 20 Aug 2023 12:29:33 -0400 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1qXlIy-0006qP-9X; Sun, 20 Aug 2023 12:29:32 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=Date:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: mime-version; bh=YZZMV1CCLOXmTrxdUPWwr6jQg7ChIU15TUsaQCIJO9k=; b=ZEKrXlGSlrbC RxoF3rodb1zYtmnVA+lYFprroVeQfZ24VWoswJ+ifyNR64SuVf9N2Go8UN89yEduIaKxMBZjBFmZO nRs1yJv4IW/W4iTpFa3qWle3GACwRIcAH3evI1IeIhVYL4QrKROEA1bGGJ4844xv4C85UHI/+wC9L hLYBgCXnhegFhJm8I4iGDRcjT5buTwoz1VMDtJTtw63n+ogfQDWW4IozhLhmmgpRdVN+WjQJaAQ1m /jq4d9/cI5LD3ljGx1vfB5QopbNUmIDCuXOqTjjyt69G5Zy5SczALfZA0NPlEEaJTWlMrUS06fB9d xdozukOZKSfi5yEeX9asXQ==; Original-Received: from ams by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1qXlIx-0000Rv-Vu; Sun, 20 Aug 2023 12:29:32 -0400 In-Reply-To: <874jkt90a5.fsf@localhost> (message from Ihor Radchenko on Sun, 20 Aug 2023 15:54:58 +0000) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:308971 Archived-At: > It's very easy to see the code of 'car' in Emacs. All you need is run > GDB: > > $ gdb ./emacs > ... > (gdb) disassemble /m Fcar So, while I can do this mechanically, it will not understand it. Not to the level to draw conclusions about what is different in Elisp compared to CL. The issue is not Emacs Lisp vs. Common Lisp. What you mean is what the difference is between SBCL and GNU Emacs.' The question can be rephrased as what is the difference between GNU Emacs and GCC? Why is GCC so much faster? And if you phrase it like that you will see that it really doesn't make much sense anymore, since you are comparing different things. Emacs could implement optimizaations that GCC does for C, or ADA .. but it breaks down very quickly.