From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.ciao.gmane.io!not-for-mail From: Richard Stallman Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Windows and MacOS and emacs.html Date: Sun, 08 Mar 2020 01:12:38 -0500 Message-ID: Reply-To: rms@gnu.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=Utf-8 Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="ciao.gmane.io:159.69.161.202"; logging-data="21918"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sun Mar 08 07:13:10 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1jApBW-0005be-TO for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 08 Mar 2020 07:13:10 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:55278 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jApBV-0007Hw-Up for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 08 Mar 2020 01:13:09 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:38143) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jApB4-0006tD-9h for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 08 Mar 2020 01:12:43 -0500 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:50203) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1jApB4-0007Mz-6B for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 08 Mar 2020 01:12:42 -0500 Original-Received: from rms by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1jApB0-0007bJ-TE; Sun, 08 Mar 2020 01:12:39 -0500 X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:245329 Archived-At: [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]] The recent request to give FreeBSD "top billing" on emacs.html, along with "GNU/Linux, Windows, and MacOS", led me to look at the page to see what that would mean. It appears that BSDs has already been listed there, which is But I saw something that is not ok: the way that Windows and MacOS are given "top billing" too. It is proper to include support for running Emacs on Windows and MacOS, given that people keep maintaining it, and useful to inform users that they can run Emacs on those systems. But we should take care to avoid appearing to legitimize the use of Windows and MacOS. The most important thing about them is that _morally_ they are _not_ on a par with GNU/Linux, or with BSD. When we tell people that Emacs supports running on Windows and MacOS, we should also point out that they are part of the problem we aim to eliminate. Would people please change emacs.html to avoid that impression? This approach could handle that. Freedom-respesting operating systems: GNU/Linux BSDs Freedom-denying operating systems: Windows MacOS However, there is another problem there. The subsections on installation on Windows, and on MacOS, are part of a section that starts with an explanation of our policy towards those systems, with heading "Nonfree systems." That much is good. But if you follow the links "Windows" and "MacOS" at the top of the page, they take you straight to the subsections. Users who follow that path get to the practical information without passing by any hint that we have moral criticism of those systems. Indeed, we would like to make it easy for users of user-subjugating systems to install Emacs and get a taste of freedom. But that _must not_ get in the way of conveying our main message, let alone cancel it out. So I think we should make "Windows" and "MacOS" link to the "Nonfree systems" header line. Any comments? Let's discuss what change to make here. -- Dr Richard Stallman Chief GNUisance of the GNU Project (https://gnu.org) Founder, Free Software Foundation (https://fsf.org) Internet Hall-of-Famer (https://internethalloffame.org)