From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Richard Stallman Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Core ELPA was: Testing fontification, indentation, and buffer manipulation Date: Sun, 03 Mar 2019 22:27:39 -0500 Message-ID: References: <7803c5de-e139-01ed-e9e3-98abb875782b@grinta.net> <2d777e7b-28d9-36a5-073d-b439fca9706a@grinta.net> <1548067539.3478998.1639830432.03003247@webmail.messagingengine.com> <87bm47558t.fsf@russet.org.uk> <87pnsm2vsm.fsf@russet.org.uk> <878sz7u2f5.fsf@russet.org.uk> <87o976p6xt.fsf_-_@russet.org.uk> <87tvgm7fnu.fsf@russet.org.uk> <871s3p5xof.fsf@russet.org.uk> <87wolfc0aw.fsf@russet.org.uk> Reply-To: rms@gnu.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=Utf-8 Injection-Info: blaine.gmane.org; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:195.159.176.226"; logging-data="117537"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@blaine.gmane.org" Cc: monnier@IRO.UMontreal.CA, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: phillip.lord@russet.org.uk (Phillip Lord) Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Mon Mar 04 04:29:46 2019 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:256) (Exim 4.89) (envelope-from ) id 1h0eIT-000UTK-SC for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 04 Mar 2019 04:29:45 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47547 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1h0eIS-0000jm-OI for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sun, 03 Mar 2019 22:29:44 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:39240) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1h0eGT-0008WF-Fb for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 03 Mar 2019 22:27:42 -0500 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:42237) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1h0eGR-0000SQ-UP; Sun, 03 Mar 2019 22:27:40 -0500 Original-Received: from rms by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1h0eGR-000842-PC; Sun, 03 Mar 2019 22:27:39 -0500 In-Reply-To: <87wolfc0aw.fsf@russet.org.uk> (phillip.lord@russet.org.uk) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:233811 Archived-At: [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]] > > That avoids the problem I thought I saw, but what is the purpose? I > > thought the idea of ELPA is that a user would get ELPA packages when perse > > wants them -- they would not be preloaded. > Perhaps. An alternative, though, would be to reduce the size of Emacs as > a monolithic entity and have many more packages that are distributed via > ELPA. At the moment, the slow release cycle of Emacs means that many > packages are only updated on a two yearly basis. I don't see how one is an alternative to the other. They seem to be talking about two different questions, both about ELPA but not the same. > > Is this a way of handling a few packages that are included in Emacs > > distros, if we maintain them in ELPA? It makes a kind of sense for > > that case, but I would expect that those testing and making Emacs > > releases would need more control over which versions of packages are > > included in the release. > Yes, although as I say, with the intention of enabling more packages to > be developed in this way. I'm not sure how many packages are currently > included in both repos (org and seq for sure). How many there will be is a different question. The question at hand is how to handle merging them into Emacs and when. I think that should be done by explicit command, not automatically or spontaneously, and not as part of building Emacs. > > If installing Emacs doesn't require a local copy of ELPA, building > > Emacs should not need one. > Building Emacs requires lots of things that installing does not. I think you have changed the subject, but since what you said is very general, I can't be sure. What sort of things do you mean? > I think this is wrong. Having stuff which is not really source (i.e. it > is not the prefered location for editing) It is source code, no matter where it is located. It is source code even when it is a copy the user has downloaded. Pastiching our definition of source code could be a good joke, but it is not a serious argument for a decision about development methods. -- Dr Richard Stallman President, Free Software Foundation (https://gnu.org, https://fsf.org) Internet Hall-of-Famer (https://internethalloffame.org)