From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Emacs vista build failures Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2008 18:47:49 -0400 Message-ID: References: <36366a980807101702r5677d096g8e62ef5b3e278868@mail.gmail.com> <87skug6tq5.fsf@catnip.gol.com> <4eb0089f0807111345h13eccdds9b2cf43370b94074@mail.gmail.com> <4eb0089f0807121340x5e26f6dbve03ef50b238f3a3a@mail.gmail.com> <87k5fph5rh.fsf@stupidchicken.com> <20080713214648.GB1076@muc.de> <20080714195651.GF3445@muc.de> <487C5FA3.4070603@emf.net> <87zloggji9.fsf@catnip.gol.com> <878wvxxkn6.fsf@catnip.gol.com> <87ej5oz4pb.fsf@saeurebad.de> <87vdyzxype.fsf@saeurebad.de> <871w1njq32.fsf@catnip.gol.com> <87iquzxgtk.fsf@saeurebad.de> <4884CFEF.8040404@gmail.com> <87ej5nxew2.fsf@saeurebad.de> Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1216680537 24803 80.91.229.12 (21 Jul 2008 22:48:57 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2008 22:48:57 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Johannes Weiner Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Tue Jul 22 00:49:45 2008 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1KL4CI-00049i-0N for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 22 Jul 2008 00:49:38 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:60403 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1KL4BO-0006dm-Tz for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 21 Jul 2008 18:48:42 -0400 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1KL4BF-0006XT-N7 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 21 Jul 2008 18:48:33 -0400 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1KL4BE-0006VM-6b for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 21 Jul 2008 18:48:33 -0400 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=54903 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1KL4BD-0006VA-Ql for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 21 Jul 2008 18:48:31 -0400 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([140.186.70.10]:52446) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1KL4BD-0007YQ-Kw for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 21 Jul 2008 18:48:31 -0400 Original-Received: from eliz by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1KL4AX-0000Lu-4I; Mon, 21 Jul 2008 18:47:49 -0400 In-reply-to: <87ej5nxew2.fsf@saeurebad.de> (message from Johannes Weiner on Mon, 21 Jul 2008 20:37:17 +0200) X-detected-kernel: by monty-python.gnu.org: Linux 2.6, seldom 2.4 (older, 4) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:101137 Archived-At: > From: Johannes Weiner > Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2008 20:37:17 +0200 > Cc: lord@emf.net, rms@gnu.org, drobinow@gmail.com, emacs-devel@gnu.org, > acm@muc.de, Miles Bader > > To be honest, I couldn't give the slightest about w32. It's a pile of > crap that should have never seen the light of day, all political issues > left aside and I, FWIW, would not consider it when designing software. Such arrogant nonsense can only be forgiven if it's spoken out of utter ignorance. Last time you took a good look at a Windows system was probably in 1998. Wake up! a lot has changed since then. Nowadays, w32 systems don't fall short of Gnu/Linux in any aspect: stability, usability, user-friendliness, etc. And the current trend in Gnu/Linux systems to mimic the Windows UI, feel, and touch bring more and more the worst parts of Windows to Gnu/Linux systems, to the degree that in a very near future they will be indistinguishable, anyway. And if you are interested in OS architectural design, then Linux is simply boring: a huge monolithic kernel that came straight out of the dinosaur 70-s. Whereas modern Windows systems are in this respect everything the Hurd wanted to be: microkernel with many services running in user space. Too bad it is under-documented (but then who has ever heard about, let alone seen, good internals documentation in the Free Software world?). Posix is only one way to go, it is not the only way. Saying I don't care for anything but Posix is like sticking to a single programming language: you will be a poorer programmer, because some paradigms evade you completely. But I'm quickly getting off topic (not that this prolonged discussion was on it, btw).