From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Joe Corneli Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: Making Emacs more newbie friendly Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 09:58:39 -0600 Message-ID: References: <874qf8d3cy.fsf@thalassa.informatimago.com> <874qf7zlk5.fsf@thalassa.informatimago.com> <87mzszxlc1.fsf@thalassa.informatimago.com> <87wts2xrmo.fsf@thalassa.informatimago.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: main.gmane.org X-Trace: sea.gmane.org 1111334529 24070 80.91.229.2 (20 Mar 2005 16:02:09 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 16:02:09 +0000 (UTC) Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sun Mar 20 17:02:08 2005 Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by ciao.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1DD2sK-0004El-9b for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sun, 20 Mar 2005 17:02:00 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1DD39F-0007HQ-DL for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sun, 20 Mar 2005 11:19:29 -0500 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1DD38U-00074M-An for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 20 Mar 2005 11:18:42 -0500 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1DD38P-00072b-JN for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 20 Mar 2005 11:18:39 -0500 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1DD38O-0006wR-Rc for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 20 Mar 2005 11:18:37 -0500 Original-Received: from [146.6.139.124] (helo=dell3.ma.utexas.edu) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1DD2p6-0003bL-N6 for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 20 Mar 2005 10:58:40 -0500 Original-Received: from lab45.ma.utexas.edu (mail@lab45.ma.utexas.edu [128.83.133.159]) by dell3.ma.utexas.edu (8.11.0.Beta3/8.10.2) with ESMTP id j2KFwdQ16332; Sun, 20 Mar 2005 09:58:39 -0600 Original-Received: from jcorneli by lab45.ma.utexas.edu with local (Exim 3.36 #1 (Debian)) id 1DD2p5-0001Vz-00; Sun, 20 Mar 2005 09:58:39 -0600 Original-To: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org In-reply-to: <87wts2xrmo.fsf@thalassa.informatimago.com> (message from Pascal Bourguignon on 20 Mar 2005 16:29:35 +0100) X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org X-MailScanner-To: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.help:25036 X-Report-Spam: http://spam.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.help:25036 "Eli Zaretskii" writes: > > From: Pascal Bourguignon > > Date: 20 Mar 2005 00:33:18 +0100 > > > > "Eli Zaretskii" writes: > > > > > > From: Pascal Bourguignon > > > > Date: 19 Mar 2005 16:45:30 +0100 > > > > > > > > 1- Probably, the theory of emacs key binding should be put in > > > > the tutorial. > > > > > > Please take another look at the tutorial--such an explanation is > > > already there. > > > > I mean, how to customize the key binding. > > Then why did you write ``the theory of emacs key binding''? What's > the ``theory'' thing about? It's about giving some sense of Grandeur about it. Rhetorics if you wll. I agree - specifically, the Rhetoric of Extensibility. Thus, in addition to being able to press M-f, M-b, I also have (global-set-key [(meta right)] 'forward-word) (global-set-key [(meta left)] 'backward-word) and 274 other globally redefined keybindings. And a fairly non-standard keyboard layout in which all the modifiers are actually within easy reach. Which, BTW, I began work on within my first three months of learning how to use Emacs and have been very happy with ever since it was completed. However, all traces of how I actually embarked on this happy adventure are lost. I know it had to do with wanting to learn how to insert latex symbols quickly and also save my hands/wrists. Key binding does need some Theory - and regardless of whether this topic is mentioned in the tutorial, it seems that all of the syntaxes could be explained in more detail the info pages. As a thought for how to actually make Emacs easier for new users to use, what do you think about the idea of having a Tutorial subsystem, like the Info subsystem? Would it help people to learn more things in a guided learn-by-doing fashion?