From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: main.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: "Drew Adams" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: RE: not too happy with Emacs 21 vertical-line dragging when scrollbars present Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2004 11:12:39 -0700 Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Message-ID: References: NNTP-Posting-Host: deer.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: sea.gmane.org 1096913597 18176 80.91.229.6 (4 Oct 2004 18:13:17 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2004 18:13:17 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Mon Oct 04 20:13:07 2004 Return-path: Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by deer.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1CEXKc-0007jw-00 for ; Mon, 04 Oct 2004 20:13:06 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1CEXRD-0001hF-Q7 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 04 Oct 2004 14:19:55 -0400 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.33) id 1CEXR5-0001hA-Cf for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 04 Oct 2004 14:19:47 -0400 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.33) id 1CEXR4-0001gy-VP for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 04 Oct 2004 14:19:47 -0400 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1CEXR4-0001gv-Rz for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 04 Oct 2004 14:19:46 -0400 Original-Received: from [148.87.2.204] (helo=inet-mail4.oracle.com) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (TLSv1:DES-CBC3-SHA:168) (Exim 4.34) id 1CEXKG-0000OY-US; Mon, 04 Oct 2004 14:12:45 -0400 Original-Received: from rgmgw3.us.oracle.com (rgmgw3.us.oracle.com [138.1.191.12]) by inet-mail4.oracle.com (Switch-3.1.4/Switch-3.1.0) with ESMTP id i94I7HWv019680; Mon, 4 Oct 2004 11:07:18 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from rgmgw3.us.oracle.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rgmgw3.us.oracle.com (Switch-3.1.4/Switch-3.1.0) with ESMTP id i94ICeG9029989; Mon, 4 Oct 2004 12:12:40 -0600 Original-Received: from dradamslap (dradams-lap.us.oracle.com [130.35.177.126]) by rgmgw3.us.oracle.com (Switch-3.1.4/Switch-3.1.0) with SMTP id i94ICd6t029976; Mon, 4 Oct 2004 12:12:39 -0600 Original-To: X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: main.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:27899 X-Report-Spam: http://spam.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.devel:27899 I'm not surprised that this was not thought of :-). [ BTW, at one point with Emacs 20 (or 19?) I discovered by chance that I could bind that small square using `nil' as the key! Later this hack possibility was removed: (global-set-key [nil down-mouse-1] 'shrink-frame-to-fit) ] Anyway... I think you mean the two mode-line characters next to the scroll bar. In my case, the scroll bar is on the right, so these would be the last (rightmost) two characters. If I understand you correctly, you are saying: 1. Leave the mode line extended under the scroll bar. 2. But change the part of it that is under the scroll bar to show a drag-handle graphic (image/glyph), indicating that you can drag that spot. Is that right? If so, that's not a bad suggestion. And it would satisfy Kim's criterion that we visually associate the scroll bar with its window. I had been complaining that the drag handle had nothing to do with (activating) the mode line, but I think your proposal is a good one. I can take a look at this, if no one else is interested in hacking it. It would be better, however, for someone already familiar with programming the new mode line to take a crack at it. I'll see what I can do, when I get some time. If this is simple to do, then someone please send the few lines of code needed. Also, is it straightforward to use something like the drag-handle mouse pointer as the glyph for those two mode-line characters? Suggestions appreciated. Thanks, Drew -----Original Message----- From: Richard Stallman [mailto:rms@gnu.org] Sent: Monday, October 04, 2004 8:19 AM To: Drew Adams Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org Subject: Re: not too happy with Emacs 21 vertical-line dragging when scrollbars present The squares where the `.' are were visible drag handles for the windows. ISTR that we never thought of them as having a purpose; they were simply unused space. So we used them to make the mode line bigger, without realizing anything useful was being taken away. At Lisp level you could put a different meaning on clicks on the first two characters of the mode line. Want to try that? It would be desirable to change what those two characters look like, so as to give a visual hint.