From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.ciao.gmane.io!not-for-mail From: Yuan Fu Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Review a blog post about emacs-devel Date: Fri, 15 May 2020 12:20:52 -0400 Message-ID: References: <2D56B465-C028-41AE-8D07-38C1C49FF5F7@gmail.com> <1AACFB17-AA77-4F74-A0D6-8CB50902A278@gmail.com> <6D8F18E1-1514-4C18-B04F-13894115F507@gmail.com> <055C009E-FE43-4FB5-999F-14F15A48DAD5@gmail.com> <83y2pt3d1d.fsf@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.4 \(3608.80.23.2.2\)) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_F3F5368D-5FB5-4DEE-8982-C8ADD0D22853" Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="ciao.gmane.io:159.69.161.202"; logging-data="84956"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: Jean-Christophe Helary , emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Fri May 15 18:21:37 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1jZd5c-000LyS-I9 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Fri, 15 May 2020 18:21:36 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:33784 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jZd5b-0001L7-Ks for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Fri, 15 May 2020 12:21:35 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:34632) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jZd4z-0000ta-TF for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 15 May 2020 12:20:57 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-qk1-x72b.google.com ([2607:f8b0:4864:20::72b]:40856) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jZd4y-0007Ly-Uk; Fri, 15 May 2020 12:20:57 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-qk1-x72b.google.com with SMTP id g185so3100245qke.7; Fri, 15 May 2020 09:20:56 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=from:message-id:mime-version:subject:date:in-reply-to:cc:to :references; bh=+DrBuhjp0eMJsX+Uo4BFX6dx9gAmKU1R0c9alo9NBYE=; b=mIkObqHepIwapI8hvjbxRsd1/tDVUtipz62R2x29R9iAw9p0YS+XKWGF5xwvzgYDvO AcJOH0HdwvBpB7bcHW0hkEZWW19sHYViZ98RlNGtQ3Bik4admqT2PpUPjqQllZr9nVDA 490lWFOHkQIpEDfHJciNn5YQlH2OEOp/D3wysumy7xXsJStyZgteba/PhB95BclH5AIe NKUpBmYzglfal03td+U97bFPaj3JWjkOKl1tFwe25boc6C23OLR5RODfTOx51ELWWkIf rdfK/bSLvgeZOwIVhE1PrfrdYKHIWiQeDDrqzw0C5tRtH3db2wpT5Ks1+yEaGlVVK6f5 L7Pg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:message-id:mime-version:subject:date :in-reply-to:cc:to:references; bh=+DrBuhjp0eMJsX+Uo4BFX6dx9gAmKU1R0c9alo9NBYE=; b=ibwku2+jehfk9SgNfdHrWq6w7yvY57bBncHZXyHQ14w1dle4dM6LpWknfmLR2dFeDu uDVQmcpMAU7VPo5Oeh+Q8SGRdmSpaOtuikUAKnsU1BGa9zRLhymbPECGMpJ/aoCSrYDO nMunROaywuT3zQQxwAJl3Om8ID7UAcrHMEI8311dgH45VfviqDgMSusGtxlk6yjbMxxg 4t10MQk5grwKrv7GyV2n79uaVaGjsJzPgi4tdITZ2Z143+fe5cuzq1Yd/kjifK5zaBGu corXtxfI/VvSAsiJ9EW6f0jQPvWYkQOxQ3dmywf8HNUtxOMqFYz9oPbVU4+wrFJuqLf0 dleQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM532OXIc1WfMXuwcAR/hp2Y92hu+vEfw5GGcKr+NbcNHDtD0CVaWD lTtOAqFh7iVmSX/4DE0+MTp7gywdqdN3GQ== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJzQKJW8V4dDPgasFnO/xKxv8tl5h26kMf6eemtuShVw0BEvHCPSY4l1MipFFH2LQbSaOdMSlQ== X-Received: by 2002:a37:b3c7:: with SMTP id c190mr4011840qkf.466.1589559655388; Fri, 15 May 2020 09:20:55 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from [192.168.1.5] (c-174-60-229-153.hsd1.pa.comcast.net. [174.60.229.153]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id h134sm1923401qke.6.2020.05.15.09.20.54 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Fri, 15 May 2020 09:20:54 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <83y2pt3d1d.fsf@gnu.org> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.80.23.2.2) Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2607:f8b0:4864:20::72b; envelope-from=casouri@gmail.com; helo=mail-qk1-x72b.google.com X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: No matching host in p0f cache. That's all we know. X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001 autolearn=_AUTOLEARN X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:250400 Archived-At: --Apple-Mail=_F3F5368D-5FB5-4DEE-8982-C8ADD0D22853 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 > On May 15, 2020, at 2:52 AM, Eli Zaretskii wrote: >=20 >> From: Yuan Fu >> Date: Thu, 14 May 2020 22:57:58 -0400 >> Cc: Emacs developers >>=20 >> I think couple days ago someone (Joao?) read the copyright assignment = and said FSF shares the copyright >> with the assignee, is that right? If so I should change the = =E2=80=9Cgive=E2=80=9D in =E2=80=9CBy signing the assignment, you give = the >> copyright of your code to FSF.=E2=80=9D to =E2=80=9Cshare=E2=80=9D.=20= >=20 > I don't think "share" quite catches this, but IANAL. >=20 > Why do you need to include these details in a blog about Emacs? >=20 I mentioned that one needs to sign the assignment to get their code = merged. Relevant paragraph: You don=E2=80=99t need a copyright assignment to send patches for = review. But for the patch to merge into Emacs, it needs to have a = copyright assignment signed if it is non-trivial (=E2=89=A5 15 lines of = code, as a rule of thumb). By signing the assignment, you give the = copyright of your code to FSF. (See more at = [[https://www.gnu.org/licenses/why-assign.en.html][Why Copyright = Assignment]].) You need to first check with your employer before signing = it. Most of the time it=E2=80=99s no problem. To sign the assignment, = ask for a form on the mailing list, and someone will send it to you. You = fill it in and send it to an =E2=80=9CFSF clerk=E2=80=9D, then he sends = you the document to sign, either by email or by mail. You sign it and = send it back, and he sends you the final document with an FSF signature = on it.=20 Before now I thought by signing the assignment I give up my copyright = and give to FSF. That didn=E2=80=99t bother me, but I=E2=80=99m sure = there are people that doesn=E2=80=99t like to give up their copyright. I = thought I ought to make clear that you don=E2=80=99t lose your = copyright. >> Also, does that mean the assignee can change the license to public = domain? >=20 > Yes, but only for the version the assignee him/herself distributes, > not for the code contributed to Emacs. AFAIU, at least. >=20 > In effect, AFAIU, the agreement splits the code into 2 separate > versions: one is distributed by Emacs under GPL, the other could be > distributed by the author under any license the author choses, > including a non-free one. Thanks, I understand now. Yuan= --Apple-Mail=_F3F5368D-5FB5-4DEE-8982-C8ADD0D22853 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8

On May 15, 2020, at 2:52 AM, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> = wrote:

From: Yuan Fu <casouri@gmail.com>
Date: Thu, 14 May 2020 22:57:58 -0400
Cc: Emacs = developers <emacs-devel@gnu.org>

I = think couple days ago someone (Joao?) read the copyright assignment and = said FSF shares the copyright
with the assignee, is that = right? If so I should change the =E2=80=9Cgive=E2=80=9D in =E2=80=9CBy = signing the assignment, you give the
copyright of your = code to FSF.=E2=80=9D to =E2=80=9Cshare=E2=80=9D.

I don't think "share" quite = catches this, but IANAL.

Why do you need to = include these details in a blog about Emacs?


I = mentioned that one needs to sign the assignment to get their code = merged. Relevant paragraph:

You don=E2=80=99t need a = copyright assignment to send patches for review. But for the patch to = merge into Emacs, it needs to have a copyright assignment signed if it = is non-trivial (=E2=89=A5 15 lines of code, as a rule of thumb). By = signing the assignment, you give the copyright of your code to FSF. (See = more at [[https://www.gnu.org/licenses/why-assign.en.html][Why = Copyright Assignment]].) You need to first check with your employer = before signing it. Most of the time it=E2=80=99s no problem. To sign the = assignment, ask for a form on the mailing list, and someone will send it = to you. You fill it in and send it to an =E2=80=9CFSF clerk=E2=80=9D, = then he sends you the document to sign, either by email or by mail. You = sign it and send it back, and he sends you the final document with an = FSF signature on it. 

Before now I thought by = signing the assignment I give up my copyright and give to FSF. That = didn=E2=80=99t bother me, but I=E2=80=99m sure there are people that = doesn=E2=80=99t like to give up their copyright. I thought I ought to = make clear that you don=E2=80=99t lose your copyright.

Also, does that mean the = assignee can change the license to public domain?

Yes, but only for the version the = assignee him/herself distributes,
not for the code = contributed to Emacs.  AFAIU, at least.

In effect, AFAIU, the agreement splits the code into 2 = separate
versions: one is distributed by Emacs under GPL, = the other could be
distributed by the author under any = license the author choses,
including a non-free one.

Thanks, I understand now.

Yuan
= --Apple-Mail=_F3F5368D-5FB5-4DEE-8982-C8ADD0D22853--