From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: "Drew Adams" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: RE: line adjustment at the end of a sentence Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2012 07:57:16 -0700 Message-ID: References: <87pq59gihf.fsf@lapcat.tftorrey.com><5062EE61.4030306@cme.nist.gov><03938EEFC08C429891F35EF2C46CAD8E@us.oracle.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1348757870 14911 80.91.229.3 (27 Sep 2012 14:57:50 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2012 14:57:50 +0000 (UTC) Cc: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org To: "'Stefan Monnier'" Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Thu Sep 27 16:57:55 2012 Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1THFXF-0006jp-6T for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Thu, 27 Sep 2012 16:57:53 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:55187 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1THFXA-0006KY-78 for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Thu, 27 Sep 2012 10:57:48 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:59772) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1THFWv-0005nB-8U for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 27 Sep 2012 10:57:37 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1THFWo-0002rL-Vc for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 27 Sep 2012 10:57:33 -0400 Original-Received: from rcsinet15.oracle.com ([148.87.113.117]:34999) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1THFWo-0002o7-OO for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 27 Sep 2012 10:57:26 -0400 Original-Received: from ucsinet22.oracle.com (ucsinet22.oracle.com [156.151.31.94]) by rcsinet15.oracle.com (Sentrion-MTA-4.2.2/Sentrion-MTA-4.2.2) with ESMTP id q8REvNxq010374 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 27 Sep 2012 14:57:24 GMT Original-Received: from acsmt356.oracle.com (acsmt356.oracle.com [141.146.40.156]) by ucsinet22.oracle.com (8.14.4+Sun/8.14.4) with ESMTP id q8REvMPh004312 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Thu, 27 Sep 2012 14:57:23 GMT Original-Received: from abhmt108.oracle.com (abhmt108.oracle.com [141.146.116.60]) by acsmt356.oracle.com (8.12.11.20060308/8.12.11) with ESMTP id q8REvMAf022036; Thu, 27 Sep 2012 09:57:22 -0500 Original-Received: from dradamslap1 (/10.159.162.46) by default (Oracle Beehive Gateway v4.0) with ESMTP ; Thu, 27 Sep 2012 07:57:22 -0700 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 In-Reply-To: Thread-Index: Ac2cqkzFrjXJ60K0QXSDNbyCPaAgkgAEtg4w X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.6157 X-Source-IP: ucsinet22.oracle.com [156.151.31.94] X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 1) X-Received-From: 148.87.113.117 X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.help:86951 Archived-At: > > I agree generally with everything you said. Wrt showing no-break > > space and non-breaking hyphen so that you can distinguish them from > > SPC and ASCII hyphen, `show-wspace.el' can help. > > I don't think any of those comes anywhere close to the convenient of > "SPC vs SPC-SPC" in terms of showing the difference without getting in > the way. That was not the point. I was responding to your point that: > how to distinguish on screen a SPC from a NBSP. Emacs highlights > the NBSP specially (because accidental use of NBSP in program code > leads to trouble) but that's not ideal when reading text that uses > NBSP between Dr. and Watson or between < and the quoted text. The `nobreak-char-display' highlighting provided by Emacs is all or nothing (one variable for both chars together, and not a user option), face not separately customizable from escape glyph highlighting, and no toggles. Those are the weaknesses that `show-wspace.el' overcomes for these two chars and the reason it can help distinguishing them without that always getting in the way. And not just those two chars. You can use it to distinguish any chars you like. > > There are commands that toggle the distinguishing display > > of each on/off > > A really good solution would not require turning it on/off. It's not about requiring. Sometimes (and perhaps in some places) you want to distinguish such chars, sometimes you do not. You want to be able to pick those times - i.e., on demand. Other editors and word processors do this kind of thing all the time, not only wrt hard-to-detect chars but wrt other things that you sometimes want to see and sometimes do not: XML element boundaries and attributes, editor text symbols/artifacts (e.g. pilcro), conditionalized text, and so on. Just as in Emacs you can choose whether to see control chars using ^ syntax or \ooo syntax, so you can choose whether and when to see other chars in particular ways. No DWIM will ever guess just when you want to see what. You can add heuristics to try to fit common use cases, but that's all. See what XML and WYSIWYG editors do in this regard: they offer different "views" that correspond to common use cases, showing different sets of such things, and they offer individual toggle commands to handle individual such things. See Framemaker, Arbortext Epic, Oxygen, and other XML editors, for example.