From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: =?UTF-8?Q?Jordi_Guti=C3=A9rrez_Hermoso?= Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Whitespace cleanup Date: Thu, 23 Aug 2012 11:02:06 -0400 Message-ID: References: <68445DF4308F4FAC963D6B6875A4EDD3@us.oracle.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1345734160 10233 80.91.229.3 (23 Aug 2012 15:02:40 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 23 Aug 2012 15:02:40 +0000 (UTC) Cc: Juanma Barranquero , Dan Nicolaescu , Drew Adams , Emacs development discussions To: Stefan Monnier Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Thu Aug 23 17:02:39 2012 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1T4Yve-0001oP-UI for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 23 Aug 2012 17:02:39 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:54921 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1T4Yvd-0003la-CO for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 23 Aug 2012 11:02:37 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:57599) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1T4YvR-0003l9-UP for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 23 Aug 2012 11:02:35 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1T4YvL-00058C-LQ for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 23 Aug 2012 11:02:25 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-iy0-f169.google.com ([209.85.210.169]:62877) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1T4YvB-000546-GP; Thu, 23 Aug 2012 11:02:09 -0400 Original-Received: by iahk25 with SMTP id k25so1704413iah.0 for ; Thu, 23 Aug 2012 08:02:06 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:date :x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=FoteOBRZxS+Om203E34EFAvLMNRVyziH6y47Z1T0l9c=; b=WENZiZJy07DJdy4aH3G6jqjdW0mASQ6SvhGGJP5cC6FbPrYPC7pHOvtK3o60is2+9G AaTuV4BWaYakqyykCGDu0kkf2bMAxBLyp6wGoZLX3W3ysvrmSiZBJ8oErdakckzCyGZM JJ/+EXkx4x6BQyKM5gRtuxECcTcfzxg3RNdCn+A4I2YiXRn70CzvsXmW79CH+3ReOUmu 3Ny8rP/HCUXnGJrWMRt6qv7AJ4tZU1X59kXysThT5XtjXEWUBpk+Veu8UbZ+0TU36ep7 UphT3oK2IcUKX6SlL/AvtCsUlS91gbAZcWPVHUbzNadjO8NIXr7TW6crCScbAZwNOajx RAYg== Original-Received: by 10.50.236.65 with SMTP id us1mr1903216igc.17.1345734126155; Thu, 23 Aug 2012 08:02:06 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: by 10.231.207.4 with HTTP; Thu, 23 Aug 2012 08:02:06 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: X-Google-Sender-Auth: kOMLHiofvi__KI00blAheEp_mSk X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Genre and OS details not recognized. X-Received-From: 209.85.210.169 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:152773 Archived-At: On 23 August 2012 10:50, Stefan Monnier wrote: >> Why do this at all? Why use tabs like this? The only purpose this >> seems to serve in my eyes is to mess up the alignment if someone for >> whatever reason decides to change tab-width. > > I strongly discourage changing tab-width with very few exceptions. There is a lot of code out there besides' Emacs own. I have to keep changing my tab width to be able to read it all. Sometimes it's 8, usually it's 4, rarely it's 2 or 3, and if people are mixing tabs and spaces, I have to figure out what tab width they intended to use if they don't explicitly state it somehow. It's a minor annoyance I'd like to at least fix in Emacs's own source code. > If someone does change it either globally and or elisp-mode buffers, > he's on his own and we'll complain about the patches he may submit > for inclusion. But again, what is the point of having tabs at all other than promote breakage if tab-width for whatever reason changes? On 23 August 2012 10:52, Stefan Monnier wrote: >> Hm, hg's annotate and diff can be told to ignore whitespace changes. >> I understand bzr's diff also can. So it's just a matter of making bzr >> grow another feature? > > The TAB-vs-SPC is a non-problem, really. Whereas the problems with > annotate, diff, and merge are real. Maybe they can solved, but > why bother? Tabs apparently are not a problem for you, but they are for me. If you don't care either way about tabs, you won't care if we get rid of tabs in the Emacs tree either assuming I can get bzr to grow the option to ignore whitespace in diffs and annotate, correct? On 23 August 2012 10:44, Juanma Barranquero wrote: > On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 4:28 PM, Jordi Guti=C3=A9rrez Hermoso > wrote: > >> The Emacs >> source isn't always in its original tree. > > If you're editing Emacs sources outside the Emacs tree, you can add a > .dir-locals.el file. Assuming I have write permissions to that directory. Sometimes I am reading the source files from a location my sysadmin installed them in. Yes, there are more workarounds, but why create a situation in which workarounds need to exist in the first place? Look, obviously you guys think that nothing needs to be done. I do. I'm not asking anyone to do the work, but if I do that work, I just ask that you accept my work if you don't care either way. I care. - Jordi G. H.