From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: =?UTF-8?B?SmFyb3PFgmF3IFJ6ZXN6w7N0a28=?= Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Rename, delete and move current buffer and file Date: Thu, 10 May 2018 07:37:53 +0200 Message-ID: References: <89D62EC1-7B76-4590-9DE1-F8EEAE0B1C79@scratch.space> NNTP-Posting-Host: blaine.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000c3058d056bd36b9e" X-Trace: blaine.gmane.org 1525930593 20194 195.159.176.226 (10 May 2018 05:36:33 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@blaine.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 10 May 2018 05:36:33 +0000 (UTC) To: "emacs-devel@gnu.org" Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Thu May 10 07:36:29 2018 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1fGeFg-0005BH-Rc for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 10 May 2018 07:36:29 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:60336 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1fGeHn-00007y-Sp for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 10 May 2018 01:38:39 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:37301) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1fGeH6-00007g-IZ for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 10 May 2018 01:37:58 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1fGeH5-0002R9-4D for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 10 May 2018 01:37:56 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-yb0-x236.google.com ([2607:f8b0:4002:c09::236]:36298) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1fGeH4-0002Qq-UC for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 10 May 2018 01:37:55 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-yb0-x236.google.com with SMTP id o14-v6so293005ybq.3 for ; Wed, 09 May 2018 22:37:54 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=TACXo3BCr+ChVyxP3P/hbjpXht8BnGXX865zDCHdrwM=; b=rSZD7VEQ9rRsHjKAP9Wc2fSDwuHyaKgz44Bmhel363szLgTzurrO6MvwPUaG4gFq3C vm+ZajNf0e7kxbWCUdPM7MsQLO66W6uRqjHj+1Vb8skENpmtkqWm3yjjwgnu5HfenzNq 1b3m/8tZzJ1aGyj7+b7lFlSCJZl8hWpHQD2425L+KTtMhJy4ewvXjaGYdkPHPBUt2RSR ZN+eN0EJtMSWJuwZ7vBepeqD34k16ynluoLEtl/gLyw7iobQyCGjz1e/YuKwmhHXWliY UODjqQfQji6XYz5m1biw5iyIjCYncBXmNSAG2cmqwg1r6+Nviu2q5/mZpWcSPno0zw0D z56Q== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=TACXo3BCr+ChVyxP3P/hbjpXht8BnGXX865zDCHdrwM=; b=Y1DQrFSdTf+c9qXhoqb+5ilhz1ifXm9gyBqQIc2uG/A7dH0FpBLTOkSPOdPpW1Fvfk GdX5GtTMQK/FDqAv6qer4A/EFkxpo4Dj2mF63pOmlpl630iwRXG6Fpee/d8y134pDQ0f /sJ9sZHn0y5VpUr9HcLVV9ioja37eqWrQZFO2Oq7JsRr+JD1dJNL2+xGA29JLDBv37QE rVDMGUW0N8N51Xwql+IInQ2wHeR9qdn98T7REggIJlR81Knc21v0cCLIVZxEJa6Dtw67 zKhZvdebLibsGRZ+WID0+hM4/osg8FBQam9y9B0bElpfJtKbF9ykDZslg/2oyEyXmssw 42ig== X-Gm-Message-State: ALKqPwcXn6a0Sw9mxPhX0MJIM6EI4RDQCWLxadZIOEZ3LpwLTV16vrk0 eQKYDA8TJ/Xt54rFwVkqed978Z7NqWhcRhQgsWI= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AB8JxZomoeFbOfuyscfo/w+KTo9HLg3GIGYDpsHBUX7vBshom2INtvu860ssVnquSD8gEAXkjl1LKJHn9ArhffIKEJI= X-Received: by 2002:a25:1304:: with SMTP id 4-v6mr10764ybt.484.1525930673766; Wed, 09 May 2018 22:37:53 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: by 2002:a5b:b08:0:0:0:0:0 with HTTP; Wed, 9 May 2018 22:37:53 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <89D62EC1-7B76-4590-9DE1-F8EEAE0B1C79@scratch.space> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Genre and OS details not recognized. X-Received-From: 2607:f8b0:4002:c09::236 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:225187 Archived-At: --000000000000c3058d056bd36b9e Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Thu, May 10, 2018 at 1:50 AM, Van L wrote: > > > On 9 May 2018, at 22:28, Stefan Monnier > wrote: > > > >> I do not understand what you have in mind with write-file. This create= s > a > >> copy, which is natural given the name. Do you envision some changes to > it? > > > > Not sure what happened, but my first answer said: > > > > so maybe we could instead have `C-x C-w` prompt the user > > "delete the old file (y or n)?" > > > > Is there a channel for demand driven development? like: > > https://digitalocean.uservoice.com > > I believe in the longer term it is better for the Emacs devotee to learn > enough of Dired to `type R=E2=80=99 for renaming a file or use the shell = command in > that context `! mv ? delete-me=E2=80=99. > This might be a personal thing, but Dired for a quick rename is a bit like killing a fly with a cannon. I find anything involving additional buffers distracting when I am focused on changing a set of files - I am typically refactoring a program, which already involves keeping some items in working memory. It always seemed to me rename-this-file-and-buffer (or however it might be called) is one of .emacs perennial "greatest hits". It also seems like a natural extension of existing set of functions involving buffers and files. Given this, I find the response here so far rather surprising. Personally I hoped Emacs could incorporate more of the most common customizations (the ones that do not involve breaking any compatibility or preexisting behavior) into core, the amount of additional packages you have to install in Emacs to make it competitive with a modern editor is huge, and involves changing nearly everything, e.g. how page scrolling behaves, how copy/paste behaves, ... If you look at something like prelude, some of it is very opinionated, but some of it just plugs what are IMO obvious gaps in Emacs, like this one, that could be patched without breaking anything. Cheers, Jaros=C5=82aw Rzesz=C3=B3tkot --000000000000c3058d056bd36b9e Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

= On Thu, May 10, 2018 at 1:50 AM, Van L <van@scratch.space> w= rote:

> On 9 May 2018, at 22:28, Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> wrote:
>
>> I do not understand what you have in mind with write-file. This cr= eates a
>> copy, which is natural given the name. Do you envision some change= s to it?
>
> Not sure what happened, but my first answer said:
>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 so maybe we could instead have `C-x C-w` prompt the user<= br> >=C2=A0 =C2=A0 "delete the old file (y or n)?"
>

Is there a channel for demand driven development? like:

=C2=A0 https://digitalocean.uservoice.com

I believe in the longer term it is better for the Emacs devotee to learn en= ough of Dired to `type R=E2=80=99 for renaming a file or use the shell comm= and in that context `! mv ? delete-me=E2=80=99.

This might be a per= sonal thing, but Dired for a quick rename is a bit like killing a fly with = a cannon. I find anything involving additional buffers distracting when I a= m focused on changing a set of files - I am typically refactoring a program= , which already involves keeping some items in working memory.

It always seemed t= o me rename-this-file-and-buffer (or however it might be called) is one of = .emacs perennial "greatest hits". It also seems like a natural ex= tension of existing set of functions involving buffers and files. Given thi= s, I find the response here so far rather surprising. Personally I hoped Em= acs could incorporate more of the most common customizations (the ones that= do not involve breaking any compatibility or preexisting behavior) into co= re, the amount of additional packages you have to install in Emacs to make = it competitive with a modern editor is huge, and involves changing nearly e= verything, e.g. how page scrolling behaves, how copy/paste behaves, ... If = you look at something like prelude, some of it is very opinionated, but som= e of it just plugs what are IMO obvious gaps in Emacs, like this one, that = could be patched without breaking anything.=C2=A0

Cheers,
Jaros=C5=82aw Rzesz=C3=B3tkot
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