From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: chad Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Detecting changes between dark and light mode on Mac OS Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2021 11:32:51 -0700 Message-ID: References: <345983B0-C75E-46FF-870C-5FBD3D7381B9@nonceword.org> <87h7l5j8hg.fsf@gnus.org> <3B7287EE-B559-4E3B-A24E-7ABD71EFEB6F@nonceword.org> <87v99jeyue.fsf@gnus.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000009fe3a105be386915" Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="34011"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: EMACS development team , Daphne Preston-Kendal To: Lars Ingebrigtsen Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Tue Mar 23 20:22:32 2021 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1lOmbn-0008kJ-RI for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Tue, 23 Mar 2021 20:22:31 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:60018 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lOmbm-0000C4-RF for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Tue, 23 Mar 2021 15:22:30 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:58694) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lOlpz-0001pj-Ew for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 23 Mar 2021 14:33:08 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-il1-x130.google.com ([2607:f8b0:4864:20::130]:42546) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lOlpw-0005ir-WE for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 23 Mar 2021 14:33:07 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-il1-x130.google.com with SMTP id l5so19050904ilv.9 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2021 11:33:04 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=ObbN+MHByE+KjIcPdd42o5HBqYCIATKN98N9Arg81kg=; b=CjkgPXg41VAplKK+ZBSLfgcYHYrT29NKufOpUb9zKRg2diNmfK68POFipyYKSGae8y 7GE1St4AbmTUK/lKaqdC7MDkDU0JXh5AiLFi20XOFFEttAl3wt+gzB/9OITeXBoCvHn9 wTDziwAZCZQh4AiHkROoTsuuUM6k4gbJtHkR6ZvrTfD76b4WEsoctpAeOLg1z/16A0Sf EcGMhIeNXZA0ijhmtdk4BCl+2dLURC1l95eKjPYqOEQH5PgfvI2Fmn+nbKegKd+oue7h 5E9hIzPJF7r7TLnfuHHailCaZCUgwFk7UDt+Olx9GHPRkVShaWpaWp3pUeSLyE9If8ml R35g== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=ObbN+MHByE+KjIcPdd42o5HBqYCIATKN98N9Arg81kg=; b=IoVfFitRfkBRoD8hJwy5nHLYPoY6wxPHj+TXZ2dAlLHYXLNJLol3OQ8Fx4D5vEDVc8 Cm2qUq6fAYVS72iRQSKDpl6eOX+Vqu4Jx1mwqLXFvLmcybCQM4R9VNqPqY0yUkfjnLb7 ogXA5id1tp3k4zFJhdMfRzBZKbR4e9LX4tE46qxW7kneVv8MZrVS75XH+3PeelrLZYMo 6k9nwBg9od9E2Pn/fK7ebRH+2MMnWLym73sBU76OOuGldXTu3Gw3qrfPGYiLlnpJQ0FC wqzeKzE/TMroRtsZIKJrk3Iq75XO6dDAhhrVVNwQVlxkglIEnDgTjqkZXE1SjQpqRwY/ KBQA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM531jdixSdqoT6piM3xLcCJ47VExQ2JvbaBUyCXJRtERo2CfgFfIN gxLRrTdaEb2TsLv0eQL03UU5h2OqvxjWlHlMmOA= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJzD+LzHfrg3ApdNUUpWJdvfpKEDNWB4u1TjuEIAzBtCH9jBJQL+kaOV7x7GuP8to+prdJUuBg3BDNw/8Rwa5DY= X-Received: by 2002:a92:d7ce:: with SMTP id g14mr5751843ilq.255.1616524383079; Tue, 23 Mar 2021 11:33:03 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <87v99jeyue.fsf@gnus.org> Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2607:f8b0:4864:20::130; envelope-from=yandros@gmail.com; helo=mail-il1-x130.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:266888 Archived-At: --0000000000009fe3a105be386915 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" The conversations that I recall from around 5-10 years ago draw a fuzzy line around this topic (which seems appropriate). On the one hand, Emacs (GNU, the FSF, etc.) don't want to encourage people to use non-free systems by making Emacs "better" on those systems, and on the other hand, there's a recognition that the "baseline system support" for various OS's varies, including across the free/non-free boundary. Combine that with the reality that volunteer software is built by developers scratching itches, and sometimes the non-free support will drift ahead for a bit. For macos specifically, there's been an additional wrinkle in GNUstep, although that seems (from a fairly far remove, admittedly) to have become more and more vestigial over time. All that said: there is support inside emacs for switching between light and dark modes, at least inside the (included) modus vivendi/operandi pair of themes. This includes the ability to set up modus so that it is configured for both light and dark modes, has a very simple switch between the two, and has a way to automate the switch (based on a timer and/or DBUS message, IIRC). In practical terms, I believe that it should be ok to develop this support for macos now as a "baseline system support" feature that is either present or very nearly present on Emacs regardless of platform. In fact, it would be best if the macos support for recognizing the system-level switch and hook into whatever modus uses. Hope that helps, ~Chad --0000000000009fe3a105be386915 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
The conversations that I recall from around 5-10 years ago= draw a fuzzy line around this topic (which seems appropriate). On the one = hand, Emacs (GNU, the FSF, etc.) don't want to encourage people to use = non-free systems by making Emacs "better" on those systems, and o= n the other hand, there's a recognition that the "baseline system = support" for various OS's varies, including across the free/non-fr= ee boundary. Combine that with the reality that volunteer software is built= by developers scratching itches, and sometimes the non-free support will d= rift ahead for a bit.

For macos specifically, there'= s been an additional wrinkle in GNUstep, although=C2=A0that seems (from a f= airly far remove, admittedly) to have become more and more vestigial over t= ime.

All that said: there is support inside emacs = for switching between light and dark modes, at least inside the (included) = modus vivendi/operandi pair of themes. This includes the ability to set up = modus so that it is configured for both light and dark modes, has a very si= mple switch between the two, and has a way to automate the switch (based on= a timer and/or DBUS message, IIRC). In practical terms, I believe that it = should be ok to develop this support for macos now as a "baseline syst= em support" feature that is either present or very nearly present on E= macs regardless of platform. In fact, it would be best if the macos support= for recognizing the system-level switch and hook into whatever modus uses.=

Hope that helps,
~Chad
--0000000000009fe3a105be386915--