From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.ciao.gmane.io!not-for-mail From: chad Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Making Emacs more friendly to newcomers Date: Mon, 20 Apr 2020 21:44:54 -0700 Message-ID: References: <87h7xe79l7.fsf@yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000f64de705a3c5ad47" Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="ciao.gmane.io:159.69.161.202"; logging-data="115602"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: Po Lu , ndame@protonmail.com, EMACS development team , Richard Stallman , Dmitry Gutov To: Stefan Monnier Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Tue Apr 21 06:46:03 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1jQknK-000TxN-18 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Tue, 21 Apr 2020 06:46:02 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:50754 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jQknJ-0003GG-30 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Tue, 21 Apr 2020 00:46:01 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:38746) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jQkmS-0002kA-HX for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 21 Apr 2020 00:45:17 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jQkmR-0000j9-WA for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 21 Apr 2020 00:45:08 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-yb1-xb42.google.com ([2607:f8b0:4864:20::b42]:35983) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jQkmR-0000gO-Ik; Tue, 21 Apr 2020 00:45:07 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-yb1-xb42.google.com with SMTP id n188so6695997ybc.3; Mon, 20 Apr 2020 21:45:06 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=knUb9vLbesyhx/JbkzukFGrKQ0RSY9wxGHOaQl1Z58c=; b=eZSLaNPqZ9to68zkyIiEx9qSiLmc1XDRYN5odzt08y5e9m3jqaTKj741085hF3vPpe Wv7AzkkvKm+er3xnMEzQ93MMesSECcFHvk1ZHbluZ1h/Od1YihyJVY09GkpUG+TOFwLW VxT79I5o5q3LBqP9lLG/IqoLgA73tatNhgZyZ14mEsohz65F0oIf4mmGCebXGBGgj8KP aaEvVmiPCiGvTcx6IfHz0Vv3kfMVvq7orHD4TMy8Rkg9BiOJHOMrmrzg9uTzh5a/n7iH oDnA56sXFGhge/n8ALpOUUD6DPo5WwOvdIoQMma6ZBVCcy49wTEFqnM8E9XmWSYyOpxn xawg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=knUb9vLbesyhx/JbkzukFGrKQ0RSY9wxGHOaQl1Z58c=; b=XsCt06R63RcXmH1T053fI5BmvuGUjE4cYjcQIlbjy5H+4B/qduElWVPMXr5GmSX52f S7EVAwfvcWmNWgrDg0A7WBwHzCISEB/2YsaBLI8ovE0J+z4hccy+4WPLoK23Q/Lr5i6t cCfnslydawZoAHnwIeOYcQlu9BwlAPsrDonRQVQYHXVuhe04H56TJWJ2vZE1zCt7xKgg lmOs5heKT0mVePj3Pm9AxH3ba1b14pKvVHD4d66u5wd3w7+ObiI8XN7Nos7qQKjT9bLC AQYhXHZLVShF8xOyKiTVZDlIxZUUEwp/7JgMEtE8FtzptUjyDFxwxs6+n0+ko4HtFEF2 MqxA== X-Gm-Message-State: AGi0PuaU1XsX3fEEZ1GfHJ1lHeqKMOk6immWb2B/bPieYEkYkWwkxlUa oQ4yr+zJW3IVijeVquR8jouY8xjiq+0o7+Y0pW4= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APiQypIwQjViDBdIxurcOt/xXREP5jJa/GLCKyYlFqimRFLyTL5+k9R9wDATHbpTkmTxlL1lI1d3hGG43op2z0EV6FQ= X-Received: by 2002:a25:4409:: with SMTP id r9mr24036668yba.469.1587444306036; Mon, 20 Apr 2020 21:45:06 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2607:f8b0:4864:20::b42; envelope-from=yandros@gmail.com; helo=mail-yb1-xb42.google.com X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Error: [-] PROGRAM ABORT : Malformed IPv6 address (bad octet value). Location : parse_addr6(), p0f-client.c:67 X-Received-From: 2607:f8b0:4864:20::b42 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:247451 Archived-At: --000000000000f64de705a3c5ad47 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" To be clear, I think the goal would be to have a close-to-turnkey system for emacs that added emacs' side of the LSP equation, that would integrate with whatever language package the user wanted (compiler, interpreter, etc.) to use. Roughly speaking, something like emacs-lsp ( https://github.com/emacs-lsp/lsp-mode), somewhat integrated into emacs. Then a hypothetical user that wanted to program in, say, OCaml, would install either ocaml-language-server or ocaml-lsp-server, and emacs-lsp would pick it up. In some cases, emacs would probably want "links" (instructions, documentation, etc.) for getting the common language server support, but usually these are bundled the toolchain for the language itself, outside of Emacs. For example, the Go language server support is installed with "go get". HTH, ~Chad On Mon, Apr 20, 2020 at 8:45 PM Stefan Monnier wrote: > >> In general, for the kind of packages that we would > >> like to include in Emacs, we should push for that kind of solution. > > I'm not aware of any language server project where its authors would be > > amenable to including it in Emacs (or even just assigning the copyright > > to FSF). > > Including them with Emacs would be weird. Kind of like including `diff` > with Emacs. > > > Stefan > > > --000000000000f64de705a3c5ad47 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
To be clear, I think the goal would be to have a close-to-= turnkey system for emacs that added emacs' side of the LSP equation, th= at would integrate with whatever language package the user wanted (compiler= , interpreter, etc.) to use. Roughly speaking, something like emacs-lsp (https://g= ithub.com/emacs-lsp/lsp-mode), somewhat integrated into emacs. Then a h= ypothetical user that wanted to program in, say, OCaml, would install eithe= r ocaml-language-server or ocaml-lsp-server, and emacs-lsp would pick it up= . In some cases, emacs would probably want "links" (instructions,= documentation, etc.) for getting the common language=C2=A0server support, = but usually these are bundled the toolchain for the language itself, outsid= e of Emacs. For example, the Go language server support=C2=A0is installed w= ith "go get".

HTH,
~Chad
=
On Mon= , Apr 20, 2020 at 8:45 PM Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> wrote:
=
>> In general= , for the kind of packages that we would
>> like to include in Emacs, we should push for that kind of solution= .
> I'm not aware of any language server project where its authors wou= ld be
> amenable to including it in Emacs (or even just assigning the copyrigh= t
> to FSF).

Including them with Emacs would be weird.=C2=A0 Kind of like including `dif= f`
with Emacs.


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Stefan


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