From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Bozhidar Batsov Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Generating ChangeLog files. Date: Fri, 3 Jan 2014 20:09:24 +0200 Message-ID: References: <20140102095347.6834E381D0C@snark.thyrsus.com> <8761q1ljny.fsf@gmail.com> <87lhyxqztz.fsf@gmx.de> <10213981.FjEGGXvRcv@descartes> <83a9fdxtkc.fsf@gnu.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=f46d0444ee6960ef4e04ef14cf35 X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1388772575 3449 80.91.229.3 (3 Jan 2014 18:09:35 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 3 Jan 2014 18:09:35 +0000 (UTC) Cc: =?UTF-8?Q?R=C3=BCdiger_Sonderfeld?= , emacs-devel , michael.albinus@gmx.de, thierry.volpiatto@gmail.com To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Fri Jan 03 19:09:42 2014 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Vz9Be-0003P7-E0 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 03 Jan 2014 19:09:34 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:51128 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Vz9Bd-0007Mi-Tr for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 03 Jan 2014 13:09:33 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:40102) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Vz9BZ-0007Kl-7Z for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 03 Jan 2014 13:09:30 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Vz9BY-0003wL-0U for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 03 Jan 2014 13:09:29 -0500 Original-Received: from mail-ob0-x230.google.com ([2607:f8b0:4003:c01::230]:65251) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Vz9BV-0003vA-7v; Fri, 03 Jan 2014 13:09:25 -0500 Original-Received: by mail-ob0-f176.google.com with SMTP id vb8so15807430obc.21 for ; Fri, 03 Jan 2014 10:09:24 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject :from:to:cc:content-type; bh=5iox0JQpuaz78+t/ZNIO46Wlzhk5j0PSm32bLxjGY+Q=; b=eUTt0lwfId/HSZlzttU9+6MfZKmdvD/phTM1Xfb7Xr2lB3RynINvoK4Z5GEyxmbXiW YK43eGNUAlghIndNFJTFKHGyp1xHR8F8laa80cWy29k8Cw11hPnZQJzlPBPbNn3Lgesw S/mrxTWfEXnKG3IX+LYc/zhHTH3GxCjteJemNO4xC4cJkp+VoCIK0PFnS4pVQiAVbQ3t MciBQEwmGjug59lHHLhyK+URbJ/fnYC3go/j062UQ1FZpfkWravVcO0XBCYpsF3WC7xS JAaQdKUDG3qTmp8vOcjsPNggDL6gjkqi+IcBbK2X5MY/R1nNBw108t9b2hKVtvsP4ZTB LoNA== X-Received: by 10.182.223.37 with SMTP id qr5mr60279677obc.41.1388772564461; Fri, 03 Jan 2014 10:09:24 -0800 (PST) Original-Received: by 10.76.109.98 with HTTP; Fri, 3 Jan 2014 10:09:24 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <83a9fdxtkc.fsf@gnu.org> X-Google-Sender-Auth: rxT-IMlfWS7SVKTzY9q3sxo8mVY X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Error: Malformed IPv6 address (bad octet value). X-Received-From: 2607:f8b0:4003:c01::230 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:167206 Archived-At: --f46d0444ee6960ef4e04ef14cf35 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On 3 January 2014 12:12, Eli Zaretskii wrote: > > From: R=C3=BCdiger Sonderfeld > > Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2014 10:31:39 +0100 > > Cc: Michael Albinus , > > Thierry Volpiatto > > > > I usually write patches on a branch and rebase them when they are ready > to be > > pushed. This always causes merge conflicts for the ChangeLog. (Maybe > [1] > > could help a bit.) > > There should be no merge conflicts with ChangeLog files. I see an > absolute zero of them. git-merge-changelog and the changelog_merge > plugin in bzr make this not an issue. > > > E.g., GNU Octave replaced ChangeLog with an auto-generated ChangeLog fr= om > > commit messages and they seem to be quite happy with that solution. > > I've seen a couple of projects that eliminated ChangeLogs. In every > single case, the result was a drastic deterioration in the quality of > the commit log information. > I work on a lot of open-source projects and most them have changelogs listing only non-trivial changes (as opposed to what we do in Emacs - listing everything). While I definitely think a changelog is usefu,l I don't think it's particularly good idea to simply copy the commit messages in the changelog (or vice versa). IMO the changelog should strike some middle ground between the NEWS and the commit log. As it stands now - it's mostly a duplication of the commit log, so I rarely refer to it. > > > I know the topic has been discussed several times and it seems a bit > pointless > > to start the discussion again. But in my opinion ChangeLogs are an eve= n > > bigger issue than the VC because at least I can work around the latter = by > > using git-bzr. > > As pointed out above, you should be able to resolve the former as > well, in no time. > > > --f46d0444ee6960ef4e04ef14cf35 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
On 3= January 2014 12:12, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> wrote:
> From: R=C3=BCdiger Sonderfeld <ruediger@c-plusplus.de>
> Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2014 10:31:39 +0100
> Cc: Michael Albinus <mich= ael.albinus@gmx.de>,
> =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Thierry Volpiatto <thierry.volpiatto@gmail.com>
>
> I usually write patches on a branch and rebase them when they are read= y to be
> pushed. =C2=A0This always causes merge conflicts for the ChangeLog. = =C2=A0(Maybe [1]
> could help a bit.)

There should be no merge conflicts with ChangeLog files. =C2=A0I see = an
absolute zero of them. =C2=A0git-merge-changelog and the changelog_merge plugin in bzr make this not an issue.

> E.g., GNU Octave replaced ChangeLog with an auto-generated ChangeLog f= rom
> commit messages and they seem to be quite happy with that solution.
I've seen a couple of projects that eliminated ChangeLogs. =C2=A0= In every
single case, the result was a drastic deterioration in the quality of
the commit log information.

I work on a= lot of open-source projects and most them have changelogs listing only non= -trivial changes (as opposed to what
we do in Emacs - listing eve= rything). While I definitely think a changelog is usefu,l I don't think= it's particularly=C2=A0
good idea to simply copy the commit messages in the changelog (or vice= versa). IMO the changelog should
strike some middle ground betwe= en the NEWS and the commit log. As it stands now - it's mostly a duplic= ation of
the commit log, so I rarely refer to it.
=C2=A0

> I know the topic has been discussed several times and it seems a bit p= ointless
> to start the discussion again. =C2=A0But in my opinion ChangeLogs are = an even
> bigger issue than the VC because at least I can work around the latter= by
> using git-bzr.

As pointed out above, you should be able to resolve the former as
well, in no time.



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