From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Andrew Hyatt Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Finding packages to enable by default Date: Tue, 3 Dec 2013 23:21:46 -0500 Message-ID: References: <8761ra7uq3.fsf@yandex.ru> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a11c3b1b090e99804ecadc147 X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1386130934 27630 80.91.229.3 (4 Dec 2013 04:22:14 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2013 04:22:14 +0000 (UTC) Cc: Tom , emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Stefan Monnier Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Wed Dec 04 05:22:20 2013 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Vo3ye-00079P-7Z for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 04 Dec 2013 05:22:20 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:46179 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Vo3ya-0001dl-Pd for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 03 Dec 2013 23:22:16 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:46786) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Vo3yU-0001a1-N0 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 03 Dec 2013 23:22:11 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Vo3yS-0005LN-Mx for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 03 Dec 2013 23:22:10 -0500 Original-Received: from mail-vc0-x22b.google.com ([2607:f8b0:400c:c03::22b]:40333) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Vo3yS-0005LB-Gq for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 03 Dec 2013 23:22:08 -0500 Original-Received: by mail-vc0-f171.google.com with SMTP id ik5so10684337vcb.2 for ; Tue, 03 Dec 2013 20:22:07 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-type; bh=3H+KgP0vFE4bLzpzL0va2LHUcg7Crg/xqsgQ+N/1pW0=; b=eyvw9IlDzLFHZkSiKOzcmC7kqQ4gYd575nOJIA1I7rm2hHA9wp986U+pfSwJyxYTk2 W7d7CC0Itw6GOQhNaZu8fLqVhZriRYe8Am4iLupJnU3Tmk+s7KIiOE15O6Z3lFqc11AS LS7ImhLAbbRyN/qH+ZUd+p6DOlqh6lL4XNiew96/7Vw3rGQ6h3g35s7Tk2xGKHPJ5uBe kIqcQ4BsA09Dn977WqUAt+O1+94K4BcI2iEGASbHBGxbKKGlBf2955Ac9V42HnxegKCw WKcz6YnDtKfPJh4/3YhiEboA6N2hfEDdOdKUNCZkiBjr6pdttLQo4G9dPKqK7AWnyfJH 0jXA== X-Received: by 10.220.17.131 with SMTP id s3mr8118050vca.20.1386130927814; Tue, 03 Dec 2013 20:22:07 -0800 (PST) Original-Received: by 10.221.9.6 with HTTP; Tue, 3 Dec 2013 20:21:46 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Error: Malformed IPv6 address (bad octet value). X-Received-From: 2607:f8b0:400c:c03::22b X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:166062 Archived-At: --001a11c3b1b090e99804ecadc147 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 This isn't the more scientific package usage measurements found elsewhere in this thread, but I asked on the Google+ Emacs community, and got a list of the following packages people thought should be enabled by default: cua-mode cua-selection-mode column-number-mode delete-selection-mode desktop-save-mode dired-x global-linnum-mode global-subword-mode ido-mode icomplete-mode iswitchb-mode recentf-mode savehist-mode saveplace show-paren-mode size-indication-mode uniquify which-function-mode winner-mode There's more, but the rest are variable settings, keybindings and misc functions that are useful. You can find all of it at https://plus.google.com/+AndrewHyatt/posts/RTguQsNobjg (may not work without javascript). On Tue, Dec 3, 2013 at 11:09 PM, Stefan Monnier wrote: > > I did some manual filtering as a test and here are some of the top > packages > > which remained: > > > (ido . 137) > > (uniquify . 136) > > (imenu . 114) > > (eldoc . 113) > > (ispell . 107) > > (flyspell . 91) > > (recentf . 90) > > (saveplace . 77) > > (yasnippet . 75) > > (windmove . 70) > > (auto-complete . 66) > > (delsel . 64) > > (paredit . 49) > > (iswitchb . 46) > > (savehist . 43) > > (linum . 38) > > (icomplete . 34) > > (winner . 34) > > (hippie-exp . 32) > > (ibuffer . 29) > > ... > > Great, thanks. `uniquify' is now enabled by default. > `ido' is rather problematic because it's a very different interface with > incompatible key-bindings and it is not a superset of the current > default completion UI. > > > Ido is at the top (iswitchb is also here) and ido/isiwtchb would really > > make a much better first impression for new users than the default > > very barebone buffer switching. > > Iswitchb is marked obsolete in the trunk: you can get the same > functionality with icomplete-mode. So you can increase the count of > `icomplete-mode' for all users who have enabled iswitchb without > enabling icomplete-mode. > > The plan for "ido by default" is rather to slowly make ido obsolete by > adding the corresponding functionality either in the default completion > UI or in icomplete-mode. > An alternative is to try and re-implement it on top of the current > completion UI. To a large extent, it boils down to the same. > > > Of course, this package measurement should be repeated with > > representative data, but even with the data acquired from bug reports > > it gives some ideas for packages which could be enabled by default. > > Indeed. But I think it can be a good starting point for discussions > about individual packages. > > > Stefan > > > --001a11c3b1b090e99804ecadc147 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
This isn't the more scientific package usage measureme= nts found elsewhere in this thread, but I asked on the Google+ Emacs commun= ity, and got a list of the following packages people thought should be enab= led by default:

cua-mode
cua-selection-mode
column-number-mode
delete-selection-mode
desktop-save-mode
dired-x
globa= l-linnum-mode
global-subword-mode
ido-mode
icomplete-mode
iswitchb-mode
recentf-mode
savehist-mode
saveplace
show-paren-mode
size-indication-mode
uniquify
which-function-mode
winner-mode
There's more, but the rest are variable settings, keybindings= and misc functions that are useful. You can find all of it at=A0https://plus.google.com/+AndrewHyatt/= posts/RTguQsNobjg (may not work without javascript).



On Tue, Dec 3, 2013 at 11:09 PM, Stefan = Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> wrote:
> I did some manual filtering as a test and here are s= ome of the top packages
> which remained:

> (ido . 137)
> (uniquify . 136)
> (imenu . 114)
> (eldoc . 113)
> (ispell . 107)
> (flyspell . 91)
> (recentf . 90)
> (saveplace . 77)
> (yasnippet . 75)
> (windmove . 70)
> (auto-complete . 66)
> (delsel . 64)
> (paredit . 49)
> (iswitchb . 46)
> (savehist . 43)
> (linum . 38)
> (icomplete . 34)
> (winner . 34)
> (hippie-exp . 32)
> (ibuffer . 29)
> ...

Great, thanks. =A0`uniquify' is now enabled by default.
`ido' is rather problematic because it's a very different interface= with
incompatible key-bindings and it is not a superset of the current
default completion UI.

> Ido is at the top (iswitchb is also here) and ido/isiwtchb would reall= y
> make a much better first impression for new users than the default
> very barebone buffer switching.

Iswitchb is marked obsolete in the trunk: you can get the same
functionality with icomplete-mode. =A0So you can increase the count of
`icomplete-mode' for all users who have enabled iswitchb without
enabling icomplete-mode.

The plan for "ido by default" is rather to slowly make ido obsole= te by
adding the corresponding functionality either in the default completion
UI or in icomplete-mode.
An alternative is to try and re-implement it on top of the current
completion UI. =A0To a large extent, it boils down to the same.

> Of course, this package measurement should be repeated with
> representative data, but even with the data acquired from bug reports<= br> > it gives some ideas for packages which could be enabled by default.
Indeed. =A0But I think it can be a good starting point for discussion= s
about individual packages.


=A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 Stefan



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