From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.ciao.gmane.io!not-for-mail From: =?UTF-8?B?Sm/Do28gVMOhdm9yYQ==?= Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: A prototype for a binding based approach to proper namespaces Date: Sun, 10 May 2020 00:46:52 +0100 Message-ID: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="ciao.gmane.io:159.69.161.202"; logging-data="32630"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: Daniel Colascione , emacs-devel To: Andrea Corallo Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sun May 10 01:47:49 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1jXZC5-0008I7-9f for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 10 May 2020 01:47:45 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:55768 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jXZC4-0007YK-9l for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 09 May 2020 19:47:44 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:52340) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jXZBV-00075b-6T for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 09 May 2020 19:47:09 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-io1-xd2b.google.com ([2607:f8b0:4864:20::d2b]:39038) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jXZBR-00018s-60 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 09 May 2020 19:47:08 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-io1-xd2b.google.com with SMTP id w4so5704046ioc.6 for ; Sat, 09 May 2020 16:47:04 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-transfer-encoding; bh=HPbh9iAitz22IjypLo09dJsfuJ6aj+PgI4tt+5LHGQM=; b=N+FizgY1dj1uHEmmTMJtLUI7mdAPDMni3w4VLoK3bJjrJqfcZFC80Z/10221L6SvFg tUy6I/XKHmJB62w3usthFRwNXHvdMXhf1M2JWss7BB/PBYpTYPLB4P5x1an+nPVS/QBk 5tnr+3U27jQFXLyg2pEkZ3SKXOWSOIlPht4fG9XU5YQVs4ff8rQcZLfHr4YBDpI0trFU 163mORNkDztEtuAx/iLvgTPcU6+ZTf4PqAxQ4rJQjT4F3hxN7CcDJeqx8x5BumvFREg4 xOfD3vMZbQ+fP3vGeGgbKh0CkaHrTRHowOccYJWwyAMki0g3HDMUekS11uwoQVlcPIpy A3tA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc:content-transfer-encoding; bh=HPbh9iAitz22IjypLo09dJsfuJ6aj+PgI4tt+5LHGQM=; b=QxDTLJtlL/NYc/l+TVH1/gQIgK3m2XNWWw5hQQ6irldKCiiOOTYypwQHN62fRr2+/W Ecs+TgFpXDPOVKk1ojE1jq6W6LflwcnXg1VQvCbmzxizG/PPttZFfmJseN4X9nmPDGzy ntqC+Ea2T2iFmDHf666GXKzRgisVhNTZpBwf+7U+sg+Fvg3hBW3OgKqXyTztGNbTBC+X ylPNN5cwMAmiP7D6tb6MmGZrL4qTWW48Njh1qHfZNO6qaBlBi1AVJqEwvmqLcIOyZiuY +fJny1iBnIJ+v6kWFZs1jGtE8k2hPOsmWFKTlQXofGgdYecS0TsucODnG72aiavINlt8 vDqg== X-Gm-Message-State: AGi0PuZtF5483w+ApGP0yeOjG/lU/wuy25N2EIM1m0+QOZi6c6AVWuvi UUkujgBVXNKp4z0CGx/1xpP9U8ei1SpkeRDx0k0= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APiQypLAEewqM/JyXwYkiMwfpn1LlFzXfYcQtEYSsNbJv+iM7Yc/bCX2Nys8RxmV9ilgYdPtec4z1iH+sEWd515O7Wo= X-Received: by 2002:a6b:6a13:: with SMTP id x19mr8999702iog.175.1589068023902; Sat, 09 May 2020 16:47:03 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2607:f8b0:4864:20::d2b; envelope-from=joaotavora@gmail.com; helo=mail-io1-xd2b.google.com X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: No matching host in p0f cache. That's all we know. X-Spam_score_int: -10 X-Spam_score: -1.1 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, FROM_EXCESS_BASE64=0.979, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001 autolearn=_AUTOLEARN X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:249604 Archived-At: On Sun, May 10, 2020 at 12:14 AM Andrea Corallo wrote: > >> If the alternative is the read time approach I think many people think > >> it has disadvantages. > > Which specific disadvantages? > I think there as been recently other discussions here on this, you can > look them up. I'd say read-time side effects Can you be specific? "Read-time side effects" _is_ the read-time approach. At read time, you intern symbols, thus producing a side effect, i.e. the program's state is different than before your read. S So your assertion is hard to understand. > and symbol leakage. Where to symbols leak to? Where do they leak from? Are you describing bugs from the future? I've recently implemented a simple-minded <50-line reader-based approach, I didn't see any "leakage", but maybe I'm not looking the right place. https://github.com/joaotavora/elisp-shorthand Jo=C3=A3o