Re: IDE versus emacs

[Wally Lepore <wallylepore@gmail.com>]

> Date: Thu, Oct 4, 2012 at 1:26 PM
> From:, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> wrote:

>> Date: Thu, 4 Oct 2012 12:48:49 -0400
>> From: Wally Lepore <wallylepore@gmail.com>
>>
>> So far I have learned that the following combination of tools for
>> windows win32 platform x32 (i.e.win2k, winXP and win7) could be a
>> start but perhaps some are not needed.
>>
>> Text Editor: emacs
>> GUI Builder: GTK+2 or Glade
>> Compiler: MinGW
>> Debugger: ?
>
> GDB, of course, available for download from the MinGW site.  Nothing
> else will debug GCC-generated programs as efficiently as GDB does.
> Emacs includes a front end for it, as I'm sure you know.

Thank you Eli. Yes this sure looks like the real deal for sure. Thank
you very much. However I will most certainly have further questions
after this initial reply please and would like to know if this is the
proper mailing list to continue on with this thread/question?

If not, can you please direct me to the proper mailing list? I
certainly don't prefer to drag you thru all questions involved in the
install process as I will most certainly do my homework first before
asking.

I assume this is the home page for MinGW -> http://mingw.org/
Is GDB part of the download for MinGW?
I found the separate download for GDB here ->
http://www.gnu.org/software/gdb/download/

Also, getting back to MinGW please. I found this interesting link
http://mingw.org/wiki/New_to_MinGW
and it appears they are suggesting I download and install additional files.
Part of the page said:

-- begin --

Download and extract

Because there are many things to use (compiler, linker, utils, API,
etc.) you need to download several files:
- gcc 	the compiler
- mingwrt 	the Mingw Runtime system
- w32api 	the Windows Application Programming Interface
- binutils 	linker, profiling, windows resources, etc.
- make 	which gathers all "things to do" to achieve your program
- gdb 	a great debugger to look inside your app while it is running

The complete name for each file to download includes its version.
You can also download the MinGW-xxx.exe file, and let it download the
rest, but probably it doesn't download the last version of each file.
The new mingw-get intaller will improve this situation when it becomes
available.

Files are compressed in Unix style: .tar.gz

-- end --

>> Linker: ?
>
> GNU Binutils, from MinGW.  You have no other choices if your compiler
> is GCC.

Ok, then I assume GNU Binutils is included in MinGW? On MinGW's web
site it said:

-- begin --

Primarily intended for use by developers working on the native
MS-Windows platform, but also available for cross-hosted use, (see
note below -- you may need to follow the "read more" link to see it),
MinGW includes:

- A port of the GNU Compiler Collection (GCC), including C, C++, ADA
and Fortran compilers;
- GNU Binutils for Windows (assembler, linker, archive manager)
- A command-line installer (mingw-get) for MinGW and MSYS deployment
on MS-Windows
- A GUI wrapper (mingw-get-inst) for the command line installer

-- end --


>> Standard "C" Library: ?
>
> Windows comes with one already, so you don't need anything.  MinGW
> runtime and headers come with a small set of additional functions that
> are missing or grossly misfeatured in the MS-provided standard library
> that is part of Windows.

Ok, but it sure sounds scary having to rely on Windows C Library. I
guess I should be ok with it....... correct?

> Be sure to download also these important tools:
>
>  ID-Utils
>  Findutils
>  Make
>  Grep
>
> and learn about etags and ebrowse that come with Emacs (if you didn't
> know about them already).

Ok, studying now. Thank you.

>> I also located the links below for GNU tools for windows (not sure if
>> I need any of these).
>> http://gnuwin32.sourceforge.net/packages.html
>> http://www.gnutoolchains.com/
>
> These are old and unmaintained.  Some of them are even badly broken.
> I recommend to look on the MinGW site first, and then here:
>
>     http://sourceforge.net/projects/ezwinports/files/

Yes I see lots of files. I have no idea what they are utilized for but
I will study and find out. Also Eli, I have little experience with
working in a console environment. I have been successfully working
through the learning process in regards to how-to verify downloaded
files and checksums using md5sum and md5sums programs in the command
line. No problem. I also have many DOS books from "back in the day" to
refer to which I have benn studying much lately.

Will the set-up scenario you kindly discussed above be too
overwhelming for a newbie programmer like myself or would I be better
off simply starting with installing an IDE already set-up to run on
win32 platform such as Code::Blocks, Code Lite, lcc-win32 etc.where
all procedures are accomplished in the same window?

I understand the drawback to utilizing a complete package associated
with an IDE is that a lot of the procedures and tools are
automatically executed for the user. Most times, the user has no idea
that a particular tool is actually running a process.

At least with your recommended tools (above), I would know why a
particular tool is in  my tool box and what its used for and when to
use it. I would understand the whole process better. Its just the
installation part that I would be most concerned with. If I could
survive it.

Thank you for your patience Eli
Wally