From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Gavin Smith Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#13965: info.info conflict between emacs and texinfo Date: Sun, 18 Oct 2015 20:41:29 +0100 Message-ID: References: <20130318230008.GD31358@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at> <86d2uwl2mu.fsf@frenzy.freefriends.org> <8761276fgh.fsf@igel.home> <0q1tcs3vdi.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1445197341 32272 80.91.229.3 (18 Oct 2015 19:42:21 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 18 Oct 2015 19:42:21 +0000 (UTC) Cc: Texinfo , Andreas Schwab , 13965@debbugs.gnu.org, Karl Berry To: Glenn Morris Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sun Oct 18 21:42:12 2015 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1ZntqM-0004zT-0W for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sun, 18 Oct 2015 21:42:10 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:35346 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZntqL-0001Qk-BR for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sun, 18 Oct 2015 15:42:09 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:50429) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZntqH-0001Qf-F5 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 18 Oct 2015 15:42:06 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZntqE-0007qJ-7d for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 18 Oct 2015 15:42:05 -0400 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.43]:36462) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZntqE-0007po-54 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 18 Oct 2015 15:42:02 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1ZntqD-0006Km-TF for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 18 Oct 2015 15:42:01 -0400 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Gavin Smith Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Sun, 18 Oct 2015 19:42:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 13965 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: wontfix Original-Received: via spool by 13965-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B13965.144519729324313 (code B ref 13965); Sun, 18 Oct 2015 19:42:01 +0000 Original-Received: (at 13965) by debbugs.gnu.org; 18 Oct 2015 19:41:33 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:55403 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1Zntpk-0006K5-Gk for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 18 Oct 2015 15:41:32 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-yk0-f176.google.com ([209.85.160.176]:33888) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1Zntpi-0006Ju-3N for 13965@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 18 Oct 2015 15:41:30 -0400 Original-Received: by ykfy204 with SMTP id y204so125680491ykf.1 for <13965@debbugs.gnu.org>; Sun, 18 Oct 2015 12:41:29 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; bh=iU4f81ngumbce/4e9RmlTbkRZfjV1elE0UHVC9+e01g=; b=QTtd7sgl+QH2POu/Y1RRANOAGHlunEwx+d28bVuTedRYpYaNLWz+6kyAOQm8uqXV+k sXKq/3SqwFsfUNOtcek+zgqMSjQ7mSz3p5lmH+m2PMNy9DauFGotIlAlgL7xm0XNQBzW OdzqgdNepxdiRc2m1inaSewbHNA6ec7oQbQ+EsOz8i5pVUgSzCS/0xhoSHJ8Im5wbtjG qCMUyyPCw3l22Xw0gUn21vLMwqmj6KpRbanyDT2r7bLpavq6tAFo+ew66qfV/dr3eCi0 esMsFzl3vcblm8MWLTM8ZIQAhek6EGAaFZGKUL056sPRUJuhT9KUcM6OWcbIBvV41XcM 2NRQ== X-Received: by 10.13.223.134 with SMTP id i128mr19150281ywe.64.1445197289597; Sun, 18 Oct 2015 12:41:29 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: by 10.37.207.132 with HTTP; Sun, 18 Oct 2015 12:41:29 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <0q1tcs3vdi.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 3.x X-Received-From: 208.118.235.43 X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.bugs:107720 Archived-At: On 18 October 2015 at 19:05, Glenn Morris wrote: > Gavin Smith wrote: > >>> I'm sure there are many systems where Texinfo is installed and Emacs is not. >>> How are people on those systems supposed to learn how to use the >>> stand-alone info reader? >> >> It has its own manual. It doesn't have a tutorial, though. This would >> have to be added. It shouldn't be hard to cover the absolute minimum >> needed to be able to navigate through the rest of the manual. > > info.info is obviously written to benefit users of both Emacs info and > stand-alone info. It seems weird to me to delete it from Texinfo just > for the sake of a distribution packing issue that > > i) doesn't occur on Debian-based systems > (http://debbugs.gnu.org/14064#30) > > ii) was solved two-years ago on RedHat-based systems in the rpm > https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=927996#c11 > > If I were packaging Emacs for a distribution (let me randomly say SUSE), > I'd resolve this issue in the packaging step. But I'm just repeating > myself (http://debbugs.gnu.org/14064#33). Obviously it's your decision. Not everyone installs programs via middlemen distributors all the time. They may download and install a release tarball directly. Evidently it's a problem for some people, sometimes. For example, you might install a Texinfo release with an older version of info.info included and overwrite an up-to-date version that came with the version of Emacs you're using.