From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: John Yates Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Emacs as word processor Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2013 17:01:31 -0500 Message-ID: References: <5288A59E.7030109@dancol.org> <87vbzqfgd6.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <87mwl04w3k.fsf@zigzag.favinet> <87iovo4caz.fsf@zigzag.favinet> <877gc14vzs.fsf@zigzag.favinet> <878uwhxnqe.fsf@informatimago.com> <83txf4cw9z.fsf@gnu.org> <416D7143-AE4A-45FF-A3A3-AA208D268D97@informatimago.com> <83hab4ce1o.fsf@gnu.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=089e013d1a0c2347a304ebcb289d X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1385157696 568 80.91.229.3 (22 Nov 2013 22:01:36 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2013 22:01:36 +0000 (UTC) Cc: "Pascal J. Bourguignon" , Emacs developers To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Fri Nov 22 23:01:41 2013 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1VjynD-0002FN-Ou for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 22 Nov 2013 23:01:40 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:41294 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VjynD-0008Vw-6m for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 22 Nov 2013 17:01:39 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:50049) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Vjyn9-0008Vm-Ms for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 22 Nov 2013 17:01:37 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Vjyn8-0007kL-6K for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 22 Nov 2013 17:01:35 -0500 Original-Received: from mail-wg0-x236.google.com ([2a00:1450:400c:c00::236]:42610) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Vjyn6-0007js-AD; Fri, 22 Nov 2013 17:01:32 -0500 Original-Received: by mail-wg0-f54.google.com with SMTP id n12so658969wgh.21 for ; Fri, 22 Nov 2013 14:01:31 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject :from:to:cc:content-type; bh=skNa3kZuRwrlJQxfpLA9khSOnn7SUxnjAQSPWAR23Wc=; b=HjT3Sq5wVfGxOIFcnZ4Te/FvYpqoM6rwO2Pp4ikLdigK+ycy33ZW2XrB3Mz5BBzVYR NInVvHLg26Cx4XTjISaZ4vSMaj6I31WzWuEz0tKeK8iB6y/a3bb7edahGy3OTdW1iPQ8 Bv0GFSN4jT8EmNqfo1zqqhgcNMDBBo0+qk5OqEWOtG2IJoB5+Gsb26LFbopRlArHp2P9 nDkIhqSyb5ZOgpTm9lA/HU7w5hoip/Aj1fNCEs9PX+trIcCIYsN65EcCbeGV+K4lO+1v 3zkfBeS/h27A8bh0QTlIBVB7o5Yc4vLh+gpawZyDHzvoVWnENxvJzL3LLBE5lW3RgbKM XQMg== X-Received: by 10.194.178.166 with SMTP id cz6mr3625312wjc.53.1385157691129; Fri, 22 Nov 2013 14:01:31 -0800 (PST) Original-Received: by 10.194.201.195 with HTTP; Fri, 22 Nov 2013 14:01:31 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <83hab4ce1o.fsf@gnu.org> X-Google-Sender-Auth: xLOcefbSWNPVpmAax_r52_Trosc X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Error: Malformed IPv6 address (bad octet value). X-Received-From: 2a00:1450:400c:c00::236 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:165583 Archived-At: --089e013d1a0c2347a304ebcb289d Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 On Fri, Nov 22, 2013 at 4:38 PM, Eli Zaretskii wrote: I see no reason for these features to be connected to a style. They > can easily be separate; keeping them separate will make it easier for > users to specify arbitrary combinations of them. > Is that really the goal? When I started programming 45 years ago I wrote in the only language available for system programming: assembler. I hand laid out every looping construct. I hand allocated every register. I was entirely on my own to identify and enforce all necessary conventions. Using a high level language deprives me of some of the fine control I once had. In exchange though I can contemplate and even complete radically larger designs. I am extremely grateful for a limited vocabulary of loops, for entirely automatic register allocation and for languages that enforce strong typing. I am unmoved by the prospect of being able to specify entirely arbitrary combinations of all formatting elements at any and every point in my documents. /john --089e013d1a0c2347a304ebcb289d Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
On F= ri, Nov 22, 2013 at 4:38 PM, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> wrote:<= /div>

I see no reason for these features to be connected to a style. =A0They can easily be separate; keeping them separate will make it easier for
users to specify arbitrary combinations of them.
Is that really the goal?

When I started programming 45 years ago I wrote in the= only language available for system programming: assembler. =A0I hand laid = out every looping construct. =A0I hand allocated every register. =A0I was e= ntirely on my own to identify and enforce all necessary conventions. =A0Usi= ng a high level language deprives me of some of the fine control I once had= . =A0In exchange though I can contemplate and even complete radically large= r designs. =A0I am extremely grateful for a limited vocabulary of loops, fo= r entirely automatic register allocation and for languages that enforce str= ong typing.

I am unmove= d by the prospect of being able to specify entirely arbitrary combinations = of all formatting elements at any and every point in my documents.

/john
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