Re: New Link Syntax: Adding ATTRIBUTES (Was: org-e-html: Including ATTR_HTML)

Re: New Link Syntax: Adding ATTRIBUTES (Was: org-e-html: Including ATTR_HTML)

[William Crandall]

Hello Nicolas,

Many thanks for expanded clarity, and a new direction.

On Thu, Jun 14, 2012 at 2:51 AM,
Nicolas Goaziou <n.goaziou@gmail.com> wrote:

> I understand your problem, but inserting ATTR_HTML
> keywords in a paragraph isn't possible anymore. I cannot
> allow that as it would defeat a fundamental change in the
> new Org syntax.

This is good. While not familiar with the details, I clearly
see the value of maintaining the logical integrity of the new
architecture.

> ATTR_HTML could ... accept a list of properties that would
> be applied in order to each link in the paragraph.  But it
> wouldn't scale well...

Agreed; this is not the way to go.


> I'm open to any other suggestion. For example, link's
> syntax could be extended to allow attributes.

I like this idea, and think it is the way to go.
--------------------------------------------------

One approach would be to expand the current link syntax
from TWO to THREE pairs of square brackets.

Current syntax:
http://orgmode.org/org.html#Link-format

New syntax:

[[link]]

[[link][description]]

[[link][description][ATTRIBUTES]]


Description and attributes would be optional.

ATTRIBUTES would consisting of name:value pairs, perhaps
giving names export-type prefixes, such as HTML_STYLE and
HTML_TITLE, or LATEX_PDFBORDER and LATEX_URLCOLOR.

HTML ATTRIBUTES would map to HTML 'attributes':

http://www.w3.org/TR/html5/section-index.html#attributes-1

LATEX ATTRIBUTES would map to Latex \hypersetup 'options':

http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/LaTeX/Hyperlinks#.5Chyperref
(Subsection: Customization)


--------------------------------------------------

This would be a significant change, but it would make LINKS
"first class objects," and allow Org mode users to directly
apply rich families of link attributes/options.

The Manual should then indicate that ATTR_HTML is a
/paragraph/-level mechanism, and is no longer intended
for use with links:
http://orgmode.org/org.html#Links-in-HTML-export

There may, of course, be different/better solutions.

Thanks for continuing to move this forward!

-BC

Re: New Link Syntax: Adding ATTRIBUTES

[Thomas S. Dye]

William Crandall <bc3141592@gmail.com> writes:

> Hello Nicolas,
>
> Many thanks for expanded clarity, and a new direction.
>
> On Thu, Jun 14, 2012 at 2:51 AM,
> Nicolas Goaziou <n.goaziou@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I understand your problem, but inserting ATTR_HTML
>> keywords in a paragraph isn't possible anymore. I cannot
>> allow that as it would defeat a fundamental change in the
>> new Org syntax.
>
> This is good. While not familiar with the details, I clearly
> see the value of maintaining the logical integrity of the new
> architecture.
>
>> ATTR_HTML could ... accept a list of properties that would
>> be applied in order to each link in the paragraph.  But it
>> wouldn't scale well...
>
> Agreed; this is not the way to go.
>
>
>> I'm open to any other suggestion. For example, link's
>> syntax could be extended to allow attributes.
>
> I like this idea, and think it is the way to go.
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> One approach would be to expand the current link syntax
> from TWO to THREE pairs of square brackets.
>
> Current syntax:
> http://orgmode.org/org.html#Link-format
>
> New syntax:
>
> [[link]]
>
> [[link][description]]
>
> [[link][description][ATTRIBUTES]]
>
>
> Description and attributes would be optional.
>
> ATTRIBUTES would consisting of name:value pairs, perhaps
> giving names export-type prefixes, such as HTML_STYLE and
> HTML_TITLE, or LATEX_PDFBORDER and LATEX_URLCOLOR.
>
> HTML ATTRIBUTES would map to HTML 'attributes':
>
> http://www.w3.org/TR/html5/section-index.html#attributes-1
>
> LATEX ATTRIBUTES would map to Latex \hypersetup 'options':
>
> http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/LaTeX/Hyperlinks#.5Chyperref
> (Subsection: Customization)
>
>
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> This would be a significant change, but it would make LINKS
> "first class objects," and allow Org mode users to directly
> apply rich families of link attributes/options.
>
> The Manual should then indicate that ATTR_HTML is a
> /paragraph/-level mechanism, and is no longer intended
> for use with links:
> http://orgmode.org/org.html#Links-in-HTML-export
>
> There may, of course, be different/better solutions.
>
> Thanks for continuing to move this forward!
>
> -BC
>
>

Is Samuel Wales' extensible syntax proposal germane?
http://article.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.orgmode/10204/match=link+syntax

All the best,
Tom

-- 
Thomas S. Dye
http://www.tsdye.com

Re: New Link Syntax: Adding ATTRIBUTES (Was: org-e-html: Including ATTR_HTML)

[Avdi Grimm]

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On Thu, Jun 14, 2012 at 8:53 PM, William Crandall <bc3141592@gmail.com>wrote:

> ATTRIBUTES would consisting of name:value pairs, perhaps
> giving names export-type prefixes, such as HTML_STYLE and
> HTML_TITLE, or LATEX_PDFBORDER and LATEX_URLCOLOR.
>
> HTML ATTRIBUTES would map to HTML 'attributes':
>
> http://www.w3.org/TR/html5/section-index.html#attributes-1
>
> LATEX ATTRIBUTES would map to Latex \hypersetup 'options':
>
> http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/LaTeX/Hyperlinks#.5Chyperref
> (Subsection: Customization)
>
>
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> This would be a significant change, but it would make LINKS
> "first class objects," and allow Org mode users to directly
> apply rich families of link attributes/options.
>
>
I really like this idea!

--
Avdi

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Re: New Link Syntax: Adding ATTRIBUTES (Was: org-e-html: Including ATTR_HTML)

[William Crandall]

Hello Avdi,

I'm glad you like it!

On Fri, Jun 15, 2012 at 8:15 AM, Avdi Grimm <groups@inbox.avdi.org> wrote:

> I really like this idea!
>

This change may be Herculean--giving links full access to
target attributes--but I certainly hope not.

As I thought about it, it seems like fair amount of abstraction will be
possible, creating one org-attribute name that would export appropriately
to each target, without attaching destination prefixes to every item.
But some will likely need to be target specific.

Thanks again,

-BC


> On Thu, Jun 14, 2012 at 8:53 PM, William Crandall <bc3141592@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>>
>> ATTRIBUTES would consisting of name:value pairs, perhaps
>> giving names export-type prefixes, such as HTML_STYLE and
>> HTML_TITLE, or LATEX_PDFBORDER and LATEX_URLCOLOR.
>>
>> HTML ATTRIBUTES would map to HTML 'attributes':
>>
>> http://www.w3.org/TR/html5/section-index.html#attributes-1
>>
>> LATEX ATTRIBUTES would map to Latex \hypersetup 'options':
>>
>> http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/LaTeX/Hyperlinks#.5Chyperref
>> (Subsection: Customization)
>>
>>
>> --------------------------------------------------
>>
>> This would be a significant change, but it would make LINKS
>> "first class objects," and allow Org mode users to directly
>> apply rich families of link attributes/options.
>>
>
> I really like this idea!
>
> --
> Avdi

Re: New Link Syntax: Adding ATTRIBUTES

[Samuel Wales]

Hmm, maybe something like this:

  $[link "http://mysite.example" :label "Example" :html-attr "..."
:latex-attr "..."]

Code that adds functionality or safety to this syntax (including all
future code) will also apply to other features than links.  For a new
feature, replace the first element with id, fancy-date, or whatever
idea you have.  It might even be possible to open it up to the user in
a safe and convenient way.

Samuel

-- 
The Kafka Pandemic: http://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com

Re: New Link Syntax: Adding ATTRIBUTES

[Thomas S. Dye]

Samuel Wales <samologist@gmail.com> writes:

> Hmm, maybe something like this:
>
>   $[link "http://mysite.example" :label "Example" :html-attr "..."
> :latex-attr "..."]
>
> Code that adds functionality or safety to this syntax (including all
> future code) will also apply to other features than links.  For a new
> feature, replace the first element with id, fancy-date, or whatever
> idea you have.  It might even be possible to open it up to the user in
> a safe and convenient way.
>
> Samuel
Neat idea.  IIUC, a read macro and something like funcall would do a lot
of the work.

I'd like to see something like this, so the Org-mode buffer could
reflect the underlying, possibly user-extended, semantics:

  $[link "http://mysite.example" :label "Example" :html-attr "..."
 :latex-attr "..." :org-attr "..."]

All the best,
Tom

-- 
Thomas S. Dye
http://www.tsdye.com