From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.ciao.gmane.io!not-for-mail From: Philippe Vaucher Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: [ELPA] New package: transient Date: Sat, 2 May 2020 12:11:10 +0200 Message-ID: References: <87368npxw4.fsf@bernoul.li> <87v9ljo5d0.fsf@bernoul.li> <87ftcnxu5m.fsf@bernoul.li> <83y2qezlpd.fsf@gnu.org> <83tv12zjx1.fsf@gnu.org> <20200429101755.GF24737@tuxteam.de> <838sicw4do.fsf@gnu.org> <83zhaqu89z.fsf@gnu.org> <83sggiu2p9.fsf@gnu.org> <83r1w2u20y.fsf@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000e92da905a4a785c1" Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="ciao.gmane.io:159.69.161.202"; logging-data="9901"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: tomas@tuxteam.de, Richard Stallman , Emacs developers To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sat May 02 12:12:12 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1jUp80-0002TN-NZ for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 02 May 2020 12:12:12 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:49016 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jUp7z-0003P5-Q8 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 02 May 2020 06:12:11 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:45572) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jUp7W-0002yP-EJ for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 02 May 2020 06:11:42 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jUp7V-0005EL-V9 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 02 May 2020 06:11:42 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-lj1-x22e.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::22e]:39030) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jUp7T-00058p-B8; Sat, 02 May 2020 06:11:39 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-lj1-x22e.google.com with SMTP id u6so4841733ljl.6; Sat, 02 May 2020 03:11:38 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=J8KSDxPt5u/hguS6a62rTeQ4SyQUMDaM/P5mvbbQXU8=; b=AlgK1aO4d4o0RVnLfgqb6IiVGgichpalNbz3ckqPlxAhU5jkJIUduLs4WZD64n6+Vw tWrbPGgaiD9BRvPCnqhs8oKCubjmi+biDUBYAqEg0FWhSonDGvToozB2VrkQY91t5SjV pc5MItXcVFUGdm4RTWArvl7WT4i+oPnjDOM+C+JXTcLA1Ox4GVMOb31KCDuFO/6tRsh1 CsQPicWawAgr8cNL0YQgPx3pSE/D2+QkYHM0YjRgO3ZFNr1E8dX4awkWR+H/pwSG9ud6 qPIuDpT2roK7djciHS0HcB0UHKb11x3B0E+l6bAHTJbG4BT+us9BtaTGk5iJeungtFzO 0rtA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=J8KSDxPt5u/hguS6a62rTeQ4SyQUMDaM/P5mvbbQXU8=; b=Fmn7ppZy9YNYtZfPfAt1bHcNkiuOIm/QIt6cbIADf2CcLyj6GCH3ba/2ScshzES0FU LHLpYmBXG0nV7/FGwVe2QrEDzgNnHL//CkEbrccPlMiKfuAdt7bnoBPssQDRQiuOXBsr XQyWGmoT+a33ohF47EasUntDZ1Mc88mzmRIe9HLsFMZznBLuAvv8DMm3Jkc1jeSw5E0g FJpJlOj3kklCVqBp12wsIiVQ7NEVG0SZCm5c666ypOeqNp+jF5HFsvtNLqFb0viF1V7U 2YbQfpRoqAfHsCnscD8nRHaDEbg24P/nSpwHCHf7YisVWC7hgmtSt4ZnBee8jSBjqAOw rSOg== X-Gm-Message-State: AGi0Pubcvf2EK9Gh6w0GM5JEDfuNY7EV1THXvAmzty19HVvdO0FwNzCt TMHKMJYG43OOWtUBinTcIXAAloYDz7wbMCiLUzpDjZKI X-Google-Smtp-Source: APiQypLqwGnkEAtfl6O2Qjr5Hboo0am8BjLMZ5dA2ape4X2tDIuTTFSsrrvRCWKReDnmJuJqCbggqRdp2P9S/XZDISI= X-Received: by 2002:a05:651c:2011:: with SMTP id s17mr4585699ljo.242.1588414296696; Sat, 02 May 2020 03:11:36 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <83r1w2u20y.fsf@gnu.org> Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2a00:1450:4864:20::22e; envelope-from=philippe.vaucher@gmail.com; helo=mail-lj1-x22e.google.com X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Error: [-] PROGRAM ABORT : Malformed IPv6 address (bad octet value). Location : parse_addr6(), p0f-client.c:67 X-Received-From: 2a00:1450:4864:20::22e X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:248391 Archived-At: --000000000000e92da905a4a785c1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" > > > > While there might be some users who think that way, my workflow is > mainly to use `C-h f` to find the help of > > > the function I'm interested in. This is where not properly namespaced > libraries are hurting me. > > And if it wasn't clear: "C-h f" is for looking up a function whose > name you already know. Which is AFAIU not the case in your original > use case. > My original use case is: I want to copy an association list, I know the function will probably have "copy" in its name and "alist", let's C-h f for "alist TAB" and fail because no results. Start again with "copy TAB" and filter the lots of "copy-*" function until I find copy-alist. Now imagine if this particual function was named "asscpy" instead how frustrated I'd be :-) Also imagine how self-documenting and self-discoverable Emacs Lisp would be if things where properly namespaced, like we ask for all packages to be on MELPA/ELPA and friends. Also autocompletion becomes much easier because you type "(alist-c" and it proposes alist-copy straight away. Sorry I'm a dreamer that like predictability & consistency :-) As said earlier, probably that my way of thinking is not common around here, but I'd not be surprised if it was common for many developpers, maybe outside Emacs Lisp. Philippe --000000000000e92da905a4a785c1 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
> > While there might be some users who think that= way, my workflow is mainly to use `C-h f` to find the help of
> > the function I'm interested in. This is where not properly na= mespaced libraries are hurting me.

And if it wasn't clear: "C-h f" is for looking up a function = whose
name you already know.=C2=A0 Which is AFAIU not the case in your original use case.

My original use case is: I wa= nt to copy an association list, I know the function will probably have &quo= t;copy" in its name and "alist", let's C-h f for "a= list TAB" and fail because no results. Start again with "copy TAB= " and filter the lots of "copy-*" function until I find copy= -alist. Now imagine if this particual function was named "asscpy"= instead how frustrated I'd be :-) Also imagine how self-documenting an= d self-discoverable Emacs Lisp would be if things where properly namespaced= , like we ask for all packages to be on MELPA/ELPA and friends. Also autoco= mpletion becomes much easier because you type "(alist-c" and it p= roposes=C2=A0alist-copy straight away. Sorry I'm a dreamer that like pr= edictability & consistency :-)

As said earlier= , probably that my way of thinking is not common around here, but I'd n= ot be surprised if it was common for many developpers, maybe outside Emacs = Lisp.

Philippe=C2=A0 =C2=A0
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