From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Stefan Kangas Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Include leaf in Emacs distribution Date: Mon, 12 Oct 2020 22:13:53 +0000 Message-ID: References: <20201008.103747.1339582189858984269.conao3@gmail.com> <20201012.103522.1802478978485184324.conao3@gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="8291"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: johnw@gnu.org, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Naoya Yamashita Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Tue Oct 13 00:14:59 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1kS65q-00020a-OI for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Tue, 13 Oct 2020 00:14:58 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:51146 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kS65p-0001r8-Ok for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Mon, 12 Oct 2020 18:14:57 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:60902) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kS64r-0001Ok-7z for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 12 Oct 2020 18:13:57 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-ej1-x631.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::631]:46965) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kS64p-0006Nr-MJ; Mon, 12 Oct 2020 18:13:56 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-ej1-x631.google.com with SMTP id t25so25328981ejd.13; Mon, 12 Oct 2020 15:13:54 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=4wqerrB2I0ILNb8CZDUcP2ZpdgX44x+r7FixtD2mcUM=; b=vIiw9urUuqoYhsRjfuRLGVELRkyw8FZWHw44THqpw1SQ/qjQ2s+BtN+GGhoTh8I02c Y4DFx2HqLV28gdCwyKAAwr9CPgi/hBO1t6mpnHu50UdSJWw+ulFpuFGjQAA4NFRZ0pXC kQFgJNiGabYEvSVdH1uYFacC5yEULnXO9M0zfZ2jwSNvGwQ5EBYvP/wz217QObTmye5n E/SQ9nWAAemslyJt41h0A7NcnG1DZA1A3z84SiwLDe2MsKY8m0jjR8qfCIL2AZURXfhq USEdkwVmWVdzkYw4C5lppVXg0LsvMnwTt4ff+vpZFauwMuNTJUPde8X1fESl0NDvjGk1 2UVA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=4wqerrB2I0ILNb8CZDUcP2ZpdgX44x+r7FixtD2mcUM=; b=NB0FEDTgMThI+g5qMLino/JqsjF+8TfyO/vGXQB6SPN0ihaJ6JYQmwnBU5PpeeKb9U WrhW1er/22w8HwUP1g9yDnV6HTPlFD9VZQL8wPhC9X1mRPC11PfQUgNt5HV/+PyU0n8h BPN0GdhTzdhChAH09Lr5s2LNHJopBG4R2dFYfXqRp6cN3xhn3YfARpsRlCwaiW5asijN ve3B1/BRnrHw5WKHjWGBEY1ahAaRzMk+vvjq8ngl52UDUKRq7cv95DtYoKmCWW+L3cyS VUN8ifbZL3WxO46jZCCDetrw+ZFehH8nye88e+JLG3a0tKn69KTxx6c03v5iHXKsEXeN K8Ng== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM530qiZSYeqzJrhAek9KgERXAgNx/45gP8h+TSoEvVoHApxftpW3h DH+nH/1qBBzZw0E6NdukbPUr9Jm5Iq10x08dG2T9xMKx X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJy8n9ERbDGpzIYbMag2CQdpkNi+upBQkx/I9ucAd7kAZGszU9MQVmP0sOmvGZnLu5Ca97UGnqtOoPjmxICDynA= X-Received: by 2002:a17:906:f90a:: with SMTP id lc10mr31086076ejb.272.1602540833882; Mon, 12 Oct 2020 15:13:53 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from 753933720722 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Mon, 12 Oct 2020 22:13:53 +0000 In-Reply-To: <20201012.103522.1802478978485184324.conao3@gmail.com> Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2a00:1450:4864:20::631; envelope-from=stefankangas@gmail.com; helo=mail-ej1-x631.google.com X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: No matching host in p0f cache. That's all we know. X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:257501 Archived-At: Naoya Yamashita writes: > From my point of view the syntax of use-package is confusing. > For example, :when is naturally designed to evaluate a given > S-expression and is only enabled when non-nil is returned, but > :disabled is not. That is, (use-package flymake :disabled t) and > (use-package flymake :disabled nil) will be converted to nil, > respectively. This is unnatural. Also, :when can be a free > S-expression, but not :disabled. I'm not sure I understand. Are you saying that, in use-package, the existence of `:disabled' means that the package will not be loaded even if its value is specified to be nil? > Other keyword, :mode and :hook specify a cons cell, but :custom > specifies a list. This can be confusing for newcomers. Could you show an example of this? > Both issue are solved in my leaf. Do you see any other major benefits of leaf over use-package? Or the other way around? Could you explain why I would want to use one or the other (as a user)? Could you explain why Emacs would want to include one or the other (as developers)? I believe that the answers to the above questions would help improve everyone's understanding of the issues involved.