From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Stefan Kangas Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: master 37889523278: Add new `swap` macro and use it Date: Sun, 7 Jan 2024 09:32:25 -0800 Message-ID: References: <170452579053.27998.16123231327386305897@vcs2.savannah.gnu.org> <20240106072311.28B8FC0034E@vcs2.savannah.gnu.org> <87plye9ahs.fsf@yahoo.com> <83o7dyua0d.fsf@gnu.org> <87le9297ei.fsf@yahoo.com> <87cyue92fx.fsf@yahoo.com> <877ckm8uzz.fsf@yahoo.com> <83v886sgtl.fsf@gnu.org> <83plyescg9.fsf@gnu.org> <87wmsl7wh9.fsf@yahoo.com> <87sf397faq.fsf@yahoo.com> <87o7dx77mw.fsf@yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="38753"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: Eli Zaretskii , emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Po Lu Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sun Jan 07 18:33:27 2024 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1rMX1b-0009uF-4Y for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 07 Jan 2024 18:33:27 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1rMX0r-0006Wt-1P; Sun, 07 Jan 2024 12:32:41 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1rMX0p-0006Wl-Bn for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 07 Jan 2024 12:32:39 -0500 Original-Received: from mail-ed1-x532.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::532]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1rMX0n-0001Xm-9X; Sun, 07 Jan 2024 12:32:39 -0500 Original-Received: by mail-ed1-x532.google.com with SMTP id 4fb4d7f45d1cf-55783b7b47aso602523a12.0; Sun, 07 Jan 2024 09:32:27 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1704648746; x=1705253546; darn=gnu.org; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:mime-version:references:in-reply-to :from:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=tXBgf7brn6yiIKioRyF19qjkrG/7eSK85ttK6rEsx00=; b=URyO6axWlXZi+B2mPG8C3LfAjhoSyglhkjJT/yDXCe4On3C3XjwDbY7GFa3T5goAXk OuQ7Qcif1ISsMB+Ryhk+njKbe7d/2YPy8DYSua6MP80v61m4vYbkQWH9w2JWdBxiXzP2 M1mxhoygNh1w8/38+PyfdCu+L/zGAmY4NoubZM7QVdIYtVLeujXKWeoQPX1rYtaC2YmZ Ros5yE/VqTZY1WbqgRrCNw8d9pvwcIoiW+5tMUhoG0APJk2/4w7fJgsPgFrrqXG2E8Om 8+bhb4WkMOB6D/1uWZudQioOU9k7fiWynMsX7FUhsJjUtF7a5WJJk4/7e4t57ZBN31Am TPlg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1704648746; x=1705253546; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:mime-version:references:in-reply-to :from:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=tXBgf7brn6yiIKioRyF19qjkrG/7eSK85ttK6rEsx00=; b=GRX7gLiVg5EWjpIqm0zikHAtR5LcbgfpFb5vxchIHctDuBCj9g6+U7KIvoy3HBLMi4 iZ7YuP1u9v1wHs+AJFKH97Z5dZn5i8mgyz3F3c51F4VpJ/ZbJoxlfTVe4clkHiKQTIuH nM6ovg69N2tTKi/4lHduoiwlznBWD6560TVM2dQbFhua7LwYY6PH/rSlyrzyEEnypjLd zf1gabFfSBo/Kj8Dkm0vyg1i/fJKU285HGhLccNc6HnREXwttfjLOd+wx4HidBADCgpn OAOBZRj5Nk9A1RJ+3CoG1r4QWczueeTKHdEK+NwS+eUl7xhHbdq3Ne8wcsUdszraegXe OoGg== X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YznMf49QGxFU/h1rG1aZX1ffCab/yDkVTTsUoL77vigDwGyYADd SdvzjaqVz4IqYx6aG+YkOTo33N9L0A/aYC7jWUX8ZI12VyI= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IH95yXYgwOEJhkLSmEXRv4TUVfwjlRBgtfgu6iW1g+waPcj7gV/PsgZ8BhOJXVt4qxhJ8O842M4j/alNefEWKU= X-Received: by 2002:a50:aa8a:0:b0:556:22fd:7b8a with SMTP id q10-20020a50aa8a000000b0055622fd7b8amr1369958edc.26.1704648746021; Sun, 07 Jan 2024 09:32:26 -0800 (PST) Original-Received: from 753933720722 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Sun, 7 Jan 2024 09:32:25 -0800 In-Reply-To: <87o7dx77mw.fsf@yahoo.com> Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2a00:1450:4864:20::532; envelope-from=stefankangas@gmail.com; helo=mail-ed1-x532.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:314702 Archived-At: Po Lu writes: >> So no, I don't currently see any evidence for the claims that this >> "cannot be fixed" or is "impossible to implement in C". If there is any >> substance to that, you will probably have to explain it again. > > This has been axiomatic for eons. From the comp.lang.c FAQ: If you insist on using the word "axiomatic", which I frankly think makes no sense here, surely that's only relevant to things proscribed by the C standard. Anyways, the comp.lang.c FAQ entry you quoted here does not discuss the typeof operator. That has been changed in more recent versions. >> Now, as I have already explained, the macro is certainly less >> subjectively appealing if we have to manually write out the type every >> time. In my view it is still a bit better, since we get both more >> readable code and additional safety on our main targets. (Note that we >> don't currently use -Wconversion in Emacs.) > > Never in my life have I heard the statements for swapping two variables > characterized as "insufficiently readable", ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Quote marks are inappropriate here, because those were not my words.