From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Stefan Kangas Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#46236: 26.1; explicit the info files installation Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2021 07:40:00 -0500 Message-ID: References: <875z3bq3p6.fsf@host.localdomain> <83fszkqacg.fsf@gnu.org> <837dkvrfwl.fsf@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="1812"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: marmot-te@riseup.net, 46236@debbugs.gnu.org, rms@gnu.org To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Wed Apr 21 14:42:22 2021 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1lZCBR-0000He-PJ for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 21 Apr 2021 14:42:21 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:48102 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lZCBQ-0000tq-Sh for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 21 Apr 2021 08:42:20 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:52938) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lZCAA-0008Ak-7V for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 21 Apr 2021 08:41:02 -0400 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.43]:45607) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lZCA9-0000Bi-Vr for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 21 Apr 2021 08:41:01 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lZCA9-00064F-U3 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 21 Apr 2021 08:41:01 -0400 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Stefan Kangas Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2021 12:41:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 46236 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs Original-Received: via spool by 46236-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B46236.161900880823239 (code B ref 46236); Wed, 21 Apr 2021 12:41:01 +0000 Original-Received: (at 46236) by debbugs.gnu.org; 21 Apr 2021 12:40:08 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:57152 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lZC9I-00062k-3l for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 21 Apr 2021 08:40:08 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-pg1-f173.google.com ([209.85.215.173]:36769) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lZC9G-000624-II for 46236@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 21 Apr 2021 08:40:06 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-pg1-f173.google.com with SMTP id j7so20256206pgi.3 for <46236@debbugs.gnu.org>; Wed, 21 Apr 2021 05:40:06 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=e1rW2uQuk8OiSeZIyjR0oysMiMWM1qLkP2y1hqhwSLM=; b=Aj+KAn08KuYL2ZY8fyb5zsoakr1pddrrqXCUFv9EhhwEUUmDF6Tgt3yPDCIqGQc17c y3sxXtby+xh8CULdbtHB3yqZ67BowrAiag5gFttHV3ei89LythKwHT82J7FF8GrUkeJ/ N3y0tbOiluAKXl70t+y1t8o2zge3eBxFyWqbuVE53JS2HAVZSy1QNJ0CUyBk5vune83M SC+EuOYWRAyC7epWbCPtWZ2EXn/Nn+l4HLNWwSIfJmsLHMDwp/cqrxxmsEOsqILwAjiW UQ1ZQFxtA3NsBIccXpCDJBbX35or5VslW0L/jSHix6PzxudytXeW88ZlDImExdhPXPYZ obTQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533w/oDqpky4foRuMb1AgfVLHE8VZturKR8DkWw+LiiWos4YzGuQ B1DJe0gds08t88SxPjQt5fFhrp4SlXlibBx+fIE= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJyFMy9fZq9ri8bEZfoYPeXnueC1pOcWD+VKLQ5ezAvwzFw72HZUVughavbpnXBjEfunqIdQZjLr3NxZkO7ih/w= X-Received: by 2002:a17:90b:f0b:: with SMTP id br11mr10715116pjb.179.1619008800844; Wed, 21 Apr 2021 05:40:00 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from 753933720722 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Wed, 21 Apr 2021 07:40:00 -0500 In-Reply-To: <837dkvrfwl.fsf@gnu.org> X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "bug-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.bugs:204601 Archived-At: Eli Zaretskii writes: > It doesn't matter. I'm saying that we shouldn't name them as a matter > of principle, so as to avoid the few pitfalls you've mentioned, like > talking about non-free repositories. Right, I see now what you are saying and I agree. >> When I say `C-h r' without `emacs-common-non-dfsg' installed on my >> Debian machine, I get "Info file emacs does not exist". > > We could, for example, say something like > > Info manual for Emacs was not found; consider installing it. > > which would be more explicit and clear, I think. That's very good, yes. It points the user to the solution. >> I'm therefore starting to think that this should be the responsibility >> of Debian. They should solve the problems that they have created for >> their users; such a warning should be added by *them*. Doesn't that >> make more sense? > > We could indeed decide that it's not our problem. In fact, the > current situation is tantamount to doing just that. I think the message you suggest above imposes almost no burden on us, so that would be my first choice here. That message is also useful even in cases where there is no shenanigans from the distribution, but just an info manual that wasn't installed. If anyone asks us to do more than that, our reply could then be that it is their problem to fix.